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Archiver > APG > 2009-04 > 1240531629

From: "Jack Butler" <>
Subject: Re: [APG] DNA information needed
Date: Thu, 23 Apr 2009 20:07:09 -0400
References: <c7f.2acedaff.37224577@aol.com><14BBC111F0CB4B47BD3957D4E1A89032@acer511eba12df>
In-Reply-To: <14BBC111F0CB4B47BD3957D4E1A89032@acer511eba12df>

Quite a lot of work has been done in the area of DNA and genealogy and a
goodly amount of information about it is available on the net - a quick
search even revealed a Boswell surname study. Simple searches will yield
more info and recommendations for using than you will probably care to wade

----- Original Message -----
From: "LBoswell" <>
To: <>; <>
Cc: <>
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2009 7:32 PM
Subject: Re: [APG] DNA information needed

> My sense of stumbling in the dark was from the point of view of
> genealogist's knowledge of DNA as a tool as compared to the knowledge of
> say
> someone expertly trained and versed in the subject in the sciences.
> Hard
> to move on this list without offending someone, unintentionally or
> otherwise. Don't read a lot into that phrase. It's also probably how
> today's efforts in DNA-Genealogy are going to look to a future researcher.
> I suspect we're going to have many more such tools on offer, poached from
> other disciplines and the sciences.
> My sense was that some work had been done already in the area of DNA and
> genealogy,, looking at samples drawn from larger populations, patterns of
> migration, surname concentrations and DNA typing, trying to employ some of
> the predictive power of statistical analysis (I thought akin to polling
> approach). Have you references where statistical analysis has been tried
> (DNA-genealogy) or is this your sense of it? The statistical analysis
> side
> of things is of great interest to me, beyond just its possible use as a
> tool
> in analyzing DNA results over a larger population.
> One thing about having access to a search engine like Ancestry is that you
> can apply filters to narrow a sample down, and then apply different
> approaches to it, correlational approach more useful maybe. . I've even
> come across some rough attempts predicting the odds of finding uniqueness
> in
> given name-middle name as patterned within and across families in a given
> area. Seemed something useful there, it actually seemed to hold up well
> in
> predictive ability. Some of this wouldn't give you any hard evidence, but
> maybe expand the comfort level enough to pursue something using
> traditional
> approaches.
> long day, hope some of the above is coherent. And inoffensive (but I'm not
> troll-shy, so no worries).
> Larry
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <>
> To: <>; <>
> Cc: <>
> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2009 6:28 PM
> Subject: Re: [APG] DNA information needed
> Larry:
> Helen Leary demonstrated quite clearly almost eight years ago how to
> integrate documentary and DNA evidence, with no further theory or
> background than
> was available at that early date:
> Helen F. M. Leary. “Sally Heming’s Children: Genealogical Analysis of the
> Evidence.” National Genealogical
> Society Quarterly 89 (Sep 2001):165-207. The article masterfully
> illustrates the integration of documentary and genetic evidence.
> Since there is seldom enough documentary data to subject it to statistical
> analysis, a statistical model would be of scant help in integrating DNA
> evidence into an overall evaluation of genealogical evidence.. Whatever
> numerical confidence levels we can apply to DNA data through statistical
> analysis
> must necessarily be incorporated into the non-quantitative assessment of
> our
> other data.
> I agree that published case studies have not yet exhausted the potential
> for applying DNA data to genealogical problems, but that is far from
> stumbling
> in the dark.
> Donn Devine, CG, CGL
> Administrator -- Devine, Baldwin and J2Plus Y-DNA Studies
> Wilmington, Delaware, USA
> Devine Surname DNA Study:_
> http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~devinedna/devdna/Devine.htm_
> (http://hometown.aol.com/donndevine/myhomepage/heritage.html)
> Baldwin Surname DNA Study:_
> http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~devinedna/baldna/Baldwin.htm_
> (http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~devinedna/baldna/Baldwin.htm)
> Y-Haplogroup J2Plus Study:_
> http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~devinedna/j2plus/J2PlusTables.htm_
> (http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~devinedna/j2plus/J2PlusTables.htm)
> CG, Certified Genealogist, CGL, and Certified Genealogical Lecturer are
> service marks of the Board for Certification of Genealogists, used under
> license by board certificants after periodic evaluation, and the board
> name
> is
> registered in the US Patent & Trademark Office
> ------------------------
> In a message dated 4/23/2009 5:31:37 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> writes:
> I think this is an area that does need more theoretical or background
> work,
> maybe involving a mix of experts to establish how DNA testing can be
> employed as a tool in genealogical research. There are statistical models
> that could be employed, similar to those used to establish the error
> margin
> in polling results, for example. Right now we're largely stumbling around
> in
> the dark when it comes to really understanding the potential offered by
> this
> tool/approach.
> **************Big savings on Dell XPS Laptops and Desktops!
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> .
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