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From: Pamela Dowling <>
Subject: Birth/Death registrations vs Baptism/Burial records (was RE: [PJ] Deaths at sea)
Date: Thu, 07 Apr 2005 23:03:34 +1200
References: <OGEELKEHANIHLMOJNLCJKEENKOAA.ckennedy@bigpond.net.au><422DEADE0091C214@smtp02.syd.iprimus.net.au><OGEELKEHANIHLMOJNLCJKEENKOAA.ckennedy@bigpond.net.au>
In-Reply-To: <6.2.0.14.2.20050407184555.01e25400@mail.tpg.com.au>


Hi Liz,

At 18:51 7.04.05 +1000, you wrote:
>Sydney in 1841. <snip> however her twin sister who eventually became
>my great-grandmother was listed on her NSW birth registration as "born at
sea".

No, sorry, she wasn't listed as "born at sea" on her NSW *birth
registration* at all. :-) Her birth in 1841 was never registered, could not
be, "registration" had not been invented yet in NSW.

As I've been reading batches of listmail, I've noticed lately that many,
many listers are making this same mistake, and also expecting to find a lot
of personal details on pre-1856 records. Doesn't happen. :-(

Records of events *before* (and some after) 1 Mar 1856 in NSW, (or 1 Jun
1837 in England), are *not* "Registrations". Information on these events
was not being collected by some civil authority for purposes of registration.

These records are *church* records only, and are of *baptisms*, not births,
and *burials*, not deaths. There is a huge difference, and one which it is
necessary to understand to successfully research & use these records.

Baptismal, Marriage and Burial records were kept, with minimal personal
details, as a record for the church only, as no doubt churches still do
today. At a later time, the church registers were collected/borrowed and
entries indexed by the civil authority (RG of BDMs) and they were combined
into the NSW BDM indices to provide more complete records. These church
registers were also at some time filmed by the LDS for the RG BDMs.

So there are numerous reasons for individual baptisms and burials, if not
marriages, not appearing in the pre-1856 indices, which I'm sure most
people don't need spelled out.

Baptisms will give date of baptism, name, parents' names and sometimes the
mother's maiden name, abode, sometimes birth date, sometimes sponsors'
names. Marriage records give the names of the parties and minister's name,
along with witnesses' names. Nothing on their parents or their birthplaces,
places of origin etc. For witnesses, check the other entries for that
church, as often the witnesses seem to have been professional witnesses -
the same people witnessing a lot of different marriages in that church.

Also, note that churches were few and far between, and many of the BsBs&Ms
were performed away from the home church, by ministers who used to have
"circuits", and travel round them on horseback, sometimes carrying their
registers. This also meant inevitable losses of registers when they had
accidents like fell in the river or lost in bushfires or whatever) or that
the ministers either trusted their memories to record the details in their
registers when they returned home, or noted them on pieces of paper, which
again could easily be forgotten, lost or damaged before the entries made it
into the offical registers.

After 1856, it seems to have taken some time before the requirements of
compulsory civil registration of births, marriages & deaths were
universally observed, and some church records from this period have also
been incorporated into the BDM index.

After 1856, most people would still have had their children baptised in a
church, but there was additionally the civil requirement to *register* the
birth, and provide personal details for this registration record.

The way to tell, in NSW, whether you're dealing with a birth *registration*
or a baptismal record is by the reference number. Civil Registration
records have a reference number of year and number, e.g. 1872/2345, and
generally containe more personal details, though in the early years of
registration particularly, this is not always so. Church records - the
baptisms, marriages and burials, have a year and volume no reference, e.g.
V1837 834 66, the volume no being the 66 (so I don't know why the V is put
where it is).

Additionally, it pays to note that the dates in the pre-1856 records are
not dates of birth and death, but only of baptism and burial, and while
burials would usually be the day after death, sometimes baptisms were done
a long time after birth, even many years later. I have noticed that in some
of the Baptismal Registers, the clergy recorded the birth date, but in
others they didn't.

I hope this helps some people to better understand our church records and
the difference from the system of civil registration.

Regards
Pam
An Aussie transplanted to Rotorua, NZ.

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