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Archiver > CLWYD > 2007-07 > 1185512809

From: "Rowena" <>
Subject: [CLWYD] Cefn Moch, Tan y Graig, Garthmyn,Wm & Mgt JONES Capel Garmon / Bryn Ty Brith
Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2007 13:06:49 +0800
References: <>

5. Re: Nant y Riw Place Name - Cefn y Moch! (Patricia Williams)
It was transcribed as Cefn y Wrach in the CFHS 1851. It is very difficult
make out in the original isnt it, but on close inspection i think you are
right, it is 'moch'
In 1841 they are at Tanygraig and in 1861 are at Moel Drefriw. They moved
rather a lot !

Really! How interesting! Thanks, Patricia. Tanygraig would have been a
wonderful place to live, nestled against the shape of the land, its back
protected from the north wind and the windows facing the south and looking
over Clytiau Teg and the moorland there. I can't help wondering when I see
clusters of the same surname in a place whether they are family members
living near each other; I wonder whether the Williams family living in Cefn
y Moch in 1851, was related to Owen Williams, then living at Tan y Graig,
who moved to Gorsedd Grucyn and was the father of Thomas Williams the poet
(page on his family on I haven't been able to locate
the site of Cefn y Moch, but it is obviously pretty close. Do you know the
location of Moel Drefriw?

It is the Jones family I am on the lookout for, William and Margaret and
their children Catherine (my ggm), Anne (mother of Ann and Phoebe Garthmyn),
Margaret who moved to Trefriw, William who went to Clawdd Gwyn, Trefriw, and
Ifan/Evan who moved to Tu Hwnt i'r Bont. One of the sons moved to
Portmadoc, possibly also Morfa Nefyn, and is said to be buried in Portmadoc.
Margaret senior died in Tu Hwnt i'r Bont. There is a mention of a Gwen in a
census, but I imagine she may have died, as I've seen no mention of her
later, though I notice there was a Gwen (wife of Owen Williams, mother of
Thomas) at Tan y Graig and wonder whether young Gwen would have been her

If Wm and Mgt Jones Garthmyn is the right family, Wm would have been born
around 1830 (not in Capel Garmon church records, was the chapel operating
then, I wonder?), Margaret 1835, William Junior in 1858, Catherine 1859,
Margaret 1860, and Ann 1867. There was a William Jones born Feb 1827 to
William and Gwen of Maes Madog recorded in the CG church records, but I
dunno - is that a possibility for Wm Sr? At least there is another Gwen
involved! And on the subject of Gwens, I am also wondering whether Gwen,
wife of Owen Wms later of Gorsedd Grucyn, might have been another daughter
of Wm & Gwen Jones Maes Madog and thus possiblyt a sister in law of Margaret
and aunt to Catherine, Ann, Margaret and little Gwen.

Wm and Mgt Jones lived at one time at Pen Nant near Fronwen. I think that
might be them in 1891, so aged 61 and 56 if we have started off with the
right family, and in 1901 71 and 66 if they are to be found. If Margaret
died at Tu Hwnt i'r Bont, one would expect Ifan/Evan to be there on a
census, possibly 1901? I don't have that. In that year also, my
grandmother, Ellen Ann Roberts, was looking after the children of widowed
John Davies, who later moved to Bryniog Uchaf, married Louisa Harker, and
whose family is also linked to Annie above via his brother Arthur.


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