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From: Tim Powys-Lybbe <>
Subject: Re: POYNTZ Family
Date: Sun, 01 Nov 1998 19:30:53 +0000


Can I both branch this Poyntz discussion a couple of centuries and thank
the various contributors to date for so radically extending my knowledge
of the Poyntz family?

Having perused the data on the Poyntz-Owsley WWW page, I cannot
understand the marriage between John Poyntz and Margaret Saunder,
sometime between, depending on who you believe, 1500 and 1530.

On the one hand I have a paper by Michael L Walker in the Surrey,
England Archaeological Collections of 1956 with the title "The Manor of
Batailles and the Family of Saunder in Ewell during the 16th and 17th
centuries". I also have copies of many of the wills of the Saunders
family of that period, including the most critical to his study. His
paper makes sense of those wills, in a way that a researcher employed by
my grandfather 80 odd years ago did not, and I have some respect for
Walker's painstaking and apparently scholarly research. Walker, in a
pedigree at the end of his paper shows a Margaret Saunder of Charlcote
marrying a John Poyntz. He gives two dignificant dates, that of her
parent's marriage in 1504 and that of Margaret's death in 1558. He
shows Margaret as the fourth child of her parents and marrying (1) John
Poyntz and (2) James Skynner.

So according to this, Margaret might have been born around 1510 and
married any time after 1525.

On a second hand there is the Owsley-Poyntz records which show a
marriage between Margaret Saunders (1485-1563) and John Poyntz
(1484-1544). They also show exactly the same parents and grandparents
for Margaret Saunders as Walker's paper. John Poyntz is shown as
marrying Margaret Saunders first and then in 1527 Elizabeth Browne.
But no mention of any divorce of Margaret and John, as Margaret from
both sources lived right through the Browne marriage; further, divorce
(annulment more likely) was not exactly frequent with the non-royal
classes.

Then these records give the marriage as having four children, of whom
one is William Poyntz, born in 1505 and dying in 1601 at the very ripe
age for those times of 96. William is an ancestor of the Owsleys.

On a third hand there is the pedigree of the Iron Acton Poyntzes, a
photocopy of which I took from the book "Historical and
Genealogical Memoir of the Family of Poyntz" by Sir John Maclean in the
London SOG library a fortnight ago (by happy coincidence). This give no
dates but shows John Poyntz of Alderly as marrying Elizabeth Browne and
makes it likely that this John Poyntz was born in the 1480s. Maclean
gives no mention in this pedigree of Margaret Saunder.

This leads me to the following questions:

1. Who was the John Poyntz that Margaret Saunders of Charlecote married?
It does not look like the John Poyntz of Alderley, son of Robert Poyntz
of Iron Acton and Margaret, natural daughter of Anthony Wydevill and
Gwentlian Stradling.

2. Might John Poyntz of Alderley have married Margaret Saunder of
Charlcote as a second wife? Only if you ignore the Owsley birth dates
for Margaret herself and for her children. I reckon it unlikely that
their son William survived to 96.

Has anyone any better ideas?

--
Tim Powys-Lybbe
South Farm:
A logical entity with a real counterpart but no address bar this.

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