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From: ED MANN< >
Subject: Re: Dymoke--Fitzwilliam--Skipwith
Date: 4 Feb 1999 17:43:14 -0800


John Steele Gordon wrote:
>
> RD500 (on pp.213-14) gives the following descent:
>
> Sir Thomas Dymoke m. Margaret de Welles
> Margaret Dymoke m. Thomas Fitzwilliam
> John Fitzwilliam m. Joan Britt
> Thomas Fitzwilliam m. Joan Gunby
> John Fitzwilliam m. Margaret Wygersley
> George Fitzwilliam m. Mary Skipwith
>
> He also gives (same page)
>
> Sir Thomas Dymoke m. Margaret de Welles
> Sir Lionel Dymoke m. Joanna Griffith
> Alice Dymoke m. Sir William Skipwith
> Mary Skipwith m. George Fitzwilliam
>
> Faris (p. 94) gives Sir Thomas Dymoke's dates as abt 1428-Mar 12 1470,
> which would imply that his daughter would have to have been born after,
> say, 1450.
>
> Wedgwood (p. 335) gives Thomas Fitzwilliam as marrying "Margaret, d.
> 1463, da. of Sir Thomas Dymoke . . ." and gives Fitzwilliam's dates as
> 1405-1479). Further he states that this couple had two sons, John, the
> heir, and Sir Thomas Fitzwilliam (1427-1498), the Speaker of the House
> of Commons in 1489-90.
>
> So, unless a grandfather and grandson were born at about the same time,
> it would appear that the Margaret, wife of Thomas Fitzwilliam and the
> Margaret, daughter of Sir Thomas Dymoke and Margaret de Welles, can't
> be the same Margaret.
>
> However, if the grandfather of the Sir Thomas Dymoke above, also named
> Sir Thomas Dymoke (and who died 1422 according to the DNB)and who
> married Elizabeth Hebden, had a daughter named Margaret, the
> chronological problems would disappear. It would also make Roberts's
> generations between Dymoke-de Welles and Skipwith-Fitzwilliam line up
> much more comfortably.
>
> Does anyone know if Roberts was in error here, and, if not, how to
> reconcile all this? These people are ancestral to Diana Skipwith of
> Virginia, William Asfordby of New York, and Elizabeth Massingberd of
> South Carolina, of whom I am a tenth generation descendant.

I think you've got it. Here's the line as I have it, sources as shown:

Descendants of Thomas Dymoke

1 Sir Thomas Dymokeref #: AAP:233
+Elizabeth Hebdenref #: AAP:233
2 Sir Philip Dymoked: 23 Sep 1455ref #: (Ä202-36)
+Joan Conyersref #: AAP:233
3 Sir Thomas Dymokeaka: "King's Champion"b: Abt. 1427d: 12 Mar
1469/70ref #: (Ä202-36)
+Margaret de Wellesd: 13 Jul 1480ref #: F94:5
2 Margaret Dymoked: 1463ref #: AAP:233
+Thomas FitzWilliamd: 1479ref #: AAP:233

Note that Roberts is author of AAP.

--
FWIW; AFAIK; IMHO; YMMV; yadda, yadda, yadda.

Regards, Ed Mann mailto:

References:
Ä = Weis, _Ancestral_Roots_, 7th ed.
AACPW = Roberts & Reitwiesner, _American Ancestors and Cousins of
the Princess of Wales_, [page].
AAP = Roberts, _Ancestors_of_American_Presidents_, [page] or
[Pres. # : page].
BP1 = _Burke's_Presidential_Families_, 1st ed. [page].
BPci = _Burke's_Peerage_, 101st ed., [page].
BRF = Weir, _Britain's_Royal_Families_, [page].
BxP = _Burke's_Dormant_&_Extinct_Peerages_, [page].
EC1 = Redlich, _Emperor_Charlemagne's_Descendants_, Vol I, [page].
EC2 = Langston & Buck, _Emperor_Charlemagne's_Descendants_, Vol II,
[page].
EC3 = Buck & Beard, _Emperor_Charlemagne's_Descendants_, Vol II,
[page].
F = Faris, _Plantagenet_Ancestry_, [page:para].
NK1 = Roberts, _Notable_Kin_Volume_One_, [page].
Π= Hardy, _Colonial_Families_of_the_Southern_States_of_America_,
[page].
S = Stuart, _Royalty_for_Commoners_, 2d ed. Caveat emptor.
W = Weis, _Magna_Charta_Sureties,_1215_, 4th ed.
WFT = Broderbund's World Family Tree CD, [vol]:[num] Caveat emptor.
WMC = Wurt's Magna Charta, [vol]:[page]

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