GEN-MEDIEVAL-L ArchivesArchiver > GEN-MEDIEVAL > 2001-08 > 0998522473
From: "D. Spencer Hines" <>
Subject: Re: Was Richard III Inbred?
Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2001 00:21:13 +0100
References: <slFg7.email@example.com>, <firstname.lastname@example.org>
"Thanks for the link - it sounds like an interesting program."
Regards, -----------Brad Verity
Try it, you'll find it fascinating.
I suspect it will change some of your ideas about "inbreeding" too ---- if you have some good GEDCOM's to feed it ---- and work seriously with it.
"For by diligent perusing the actes of great men, by considering all the circumstances of them, by composing Counseiles and Meanes with events, a man may seem to have lived in all ages, to have been present at all enterprises, to be more strongly confirmed in Judgement, to have attained a greater experience than the longest life can possibly afford."
John Hayward, __The Lives of the III Norman Kings of England, William the First, William the Second and Henry I__, London, 1612, Preface
All replies to the newsgroup please. Thank you kindly. All original material contained herein is copyright and property of the author. It may be quoted only in discussions on this forum and with an attribution to the author, unless permission is otherwise expressly given, in writing.
D. Spencer Hines
Lux et Veritas et Libertas
Vires et Honor.
"Brad Verity" <> wrote in message news:...
| "D. Spencer Hines" <D. Spencer Hines > wrote in message
| > Was Richard III, [1452-1485], King of England, inbred?
| Compared to me, yes. Three of his four grandparents were descended
| from Edward III and Philippa of Hainault. Two of them - his paternal
| grandfather and his maternal grandmother - were first cousins. None
| of my four grandparents have a common ancestor (at least going back to
| the generation of THEIR grandparents, which is all I've managed to
| Compared to nemesis Henry VII, yes. Of the 4 grandparents of the
| victor of Bosworth, only one was descended from Edward III and
| Philippa of Hainault (though this one - his maternal grandfather - had
| several cross-bred lines from Edward I). The closest common ancestors
| any of the 4 grandparents had were William III, Count of Hainault and
| Jeanne of Valois, from whom his paternal grandmother and his maternal
| grandfather descended.
| > Richard III's nominal Wright Coefficient of Inbreeding [COI] is
| > approximately 6.7%. As before, this is a first approximation and other
| > figures are welcomed. The more the merrier. Different GEDCOM's, run
| > over different generational lengths, produce different results in the
| > crunching process, of course. And, GIGO. [Garbage In -- Garbage Out] as
| > always. The quality and completeness of the input GEDCOM is critical.
| > So, at 6.7%, Richard III would not be particularly inbred ---- but
| > slightly more so than Prince Charles, Princess Anne and Prince Edward at
| > 6.2%.
| Very interesting - I've never heard until now of the Wright
| Coefficient of Inbreeding.
| The one I've always suspected of suffering physical consequences of
| inbreeding is Edward, Earl of Warwick. His parents were first
| cousins, and each were the product of so much cross-breeding
| themselves. Edward was reputed to have been mentally handicapped.
| It's possible Edward, Prince of Wales, son of Richard III, also
| suffered physical consequences of inbreeding. Richard III married his
| first cousin, sister to Edward of Warwick's mother. If I remember
| correctly, Richard III's son died as a youth of some illness.
| Lucky for her descendants, Margaret, Countess of Salisbury, took the
| extremely obscure Richard Pole as her husband and brought some "fresh
| blood" in.
| > Ian Fettes's remarkable software, FTRIPLET will crunch any GEDCOM ----
| > Medieval or Modern. So, it is quite easy to determine the Wright COI's
| > for other important figures in Medieval History ---- if one has a good,
| > accurate GEDCOM, a reasonably fast computer, and some savvy.
| > Ian's Home Page is at:
| > http://home.st.net.au/~fettesi/
| > Gentle Readers may download the free software there. It's small, only a
| > tiny, 92 KB, zipped file ---- and runs under DOS. There is more
| > information as to its capabilities at the site. Ian is quite elegant in
| > the matter of not bloating his software. I appreciate that.
| Thanks for the link - it sounds like an interesting program.
| Regards, -----------Brad Verity
|Re: Was Richard III Inbred? by "D. Spencer Hines" <>|