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Archiver > GEN-MEDIEVAL > 2002-03 > 1015178462


From: "Patricia Junkin" <>
Subject: Re: Eudo la Zouche
Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2002 13:01:02 -0500


----------
>From: "Chris Phillips" <>
>To:
>Subject: Re: Eudo la Zouche
>Date: Sat, Mar 2, 2002, 5:29 AM
>

> Patricia Junkin wrote:
>> 1264 and 1289 there is a release by Richard le Swein of Swithelund, to
>> Margaret de Ferr[ariis], countess of Derby, Ellen la Zuche, Alexander
> Comyn,
>> earl of Bouchan, and Elizabeth his wife, the heirs of Roger de Quency,
> late
>> earl of Winchester......
> ...
>> 1299 when Milicent dies she is holding land of including a park held of
> John
>> Comyn, earl of Boghan, one of the heirs of Roger de Quyncy.....
>
>
> It's interesting to see Millicent holding lands of one of the de Quency
> heirs. These heirs represented the three daughters of Roger de Quency, Earl
> of Winchester (d.1264): Margaret, who married William de Ferrers, Earl of
> Derby, Elizabeth, who married Alexander Comyn, Earl of Buchan, and Ellen,
> who married Sir Alan la Zouche.
>
> So in that first extract, Ellen is the same who married Sir Alan la Zouche,
> the elder brother of Eon/Eudo, according to CP. (I think it must be dated
> before 1280/1, when Margaret died, and presumably after 1270, when Ellen's
> husband Alan died, or else he would be mentioned, as Alexander is.)
>
> If Millicent had been holding former Quency lands as a tenant of the
> Zouches, I should have thought that was a pretty strong indicator that the
> Eon who married Millicent was a son, not a brother of Alan (and therefore
> that the references in the 1250s and 1260s would be to his uncle, Alan's
> younger brother, as he is identified in one place).
>
> But I can't work out how Millicent would come to hold de Quency lands as a
> tenant of the Comyns, rather than the Zouches. Maybe it would be worth a
> closer look at how the lands descended - do you have the name of the place
> where they lay?


IN the IPM 1273 of George de Cantilupo, his heirs are: Milsanda the wife of
Eudo la Zuche and Joan de Hastings, w/o Henry Hastings and her son John
[underage]...he held Totnes in Devon by reason of pourparty of the lands &c
which were of William de Brewosa.. Haringworth in Northants. Berewyk in
Somerset....his birth was 1251 and he was born on the death of his
grandfather William.

According to Langston and Buck in Pedigrees of Some of the Emperor
Charlemagne's Descendants, Eudo did not die until 1295 which leaves the
possibility that the 1279 death date ascribed is the death date of Eudo, son
of Roger and Margaret Bisset.

The Inq. of Millicent de Cantilupe de Monte Alto de la Zouche was taken 27
Edw. I (1299) naming her son William, age 22, her heir, with lands in
Websnade,
Wodemanleye,
Birchmore,
Toternho,
Eddeworth,
Beston and
Henlawe,
Wymington,
Leteburn and
Mentmore in Bedford; lands in
Feldhamme and Wodehamme, Bucks.
Calstone and Calne in Wilts.;
Ruyton, Bulkynton, Wybytoft, Wolfareshull, including a park held of John
Comyn, earl of Boghan, one of the heirs of Roger de Quyncy in Warwick;
[Sweins may also have had some part in Bulkyngton]
Odecomb in Somerset,
Brnfield [Braunfield] and Little Houghton in N'hants.;
Totnes, Lodeswell, Cornworthy, Dertemere in Devon;
Haryngsworth in Nhants; and,
Thorp Everard, Buscby, Belgrave and lands in Leicester.

Obtained as her pourparty
the manors of Haryngsworth and Bulwick, Northants, Totnes, Devon and
considerable estates in Beds. Som. and Wilts.


WILLIIAM DE CANTILUPO IN 1253 GAINED LUBBESTHORPE. HE ALSO HELD EYTON ,
Beds.
In 1304 Roger la Zouch deceased held the manor of Lubbesthorpe of William la
Zouch by the service of the third part of a knight¹s fee; Roger la Zouch,
son and heir of the foresaid Roger was then aged 11 [b. 1268]. IPM 7 Edw I
Father is Roger b. pro. 1240-50 making it impossible for him to be the son
of Eudo and Millicent so how then could he have come to Lubesthorpe. Was he
holding it of William, Eudo's son? If so, why?

Still working on the origins of the land.

Pat


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