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Archiver > GEN-MEDIEVAL > 2002-04 > 1017882146


From: Kay Allen AG <>
Subject: Re: Complete Peerage Correction: Elizabeth Stafford,wife of JohnTuchet, Knt.
Date: Wed, 03 Apr 2002 17:07:48 -0800
References: <000701c1d9ed$048583e0$4f47fea9@ccqn801><5cf47a19.0204020249.3c4ef00c@posting.google.com><5cf47a19.0204021528.6e2a1331@posting.google.com><UJEq8.121387$u77.28489940@news02.optonline.net><009401c1db5b$de4ed620$189c8a90@leo>


My comments interspersed.

leo van de pas wrote:

> John Steele Gordon wrote :
>
> > John Tuchet, Lord Audley = Elizabeth Stafford
> > Elizabeth Tuchet = John Baskerville
> > Sir James Baskerville = --------- Devereux
> > Sir Walter Baskerville = Elizabeth Parry
> > Thomas Baskerville = Maud ferch Richard Hir
> > Walter Baskerville = Jane Mornington
> > Walter Baskerville = Mary [or Frances] Gage
> > Walter Baskerville = Judith Vaughan
> > Catherine Baskerville = Charles Somerset
> > Maria Johanna Somerset
> >
> > JSG
> >
> By comparing sources all kinds of discrepancies appear.
> For instance, Gerald Paget makes Elizabeth Touchet a daughter of the 6th
> Lord Audley, placing her two generations lower, but chronologically that
> seems wrong.,

As you know, Leo, I am not a great fan of Paget's.

> as Walter Baskerville is recorded as having been born before
> 1459 (See Paget Ancestors and Relatives of Prince Charles, P57741).

I show Sir Walter born about 1462.

The Devereux are messy and need to have more work done on them then really has
been done.

> Let's
> say his father was about 15 when he was born, being then born before 1444
> that would make John Touchet, 6th Lord Audley, a grandfather when aged about
> 24. However, Paget, under Q115482, gives the first name of NN Devereux, he
> calls her Sybil Devereux, daughter of Walter Devereux of Bodenham, by
> Elizabeth, daughter of John Merbury, Justice of South Wales.

I have Walter's father, James, born about 1436. James' father, John, was born,
I show, in 1408, but this may have been a typo in my source. Elizabeth
Touchet's father was b. 1371 and d. 1408, so Elizabeth would have been an
infant at his death. So this chronology works.

>
>
> Now comes another contradiction, Burke's Landed Gentry, 1937, Page 111
> covers the Baskerville family. Here NN Devereux is called Katherine daughter
> of Walter Devereux, Lord Ferrers of Chartley, lineally descended from Edward

Unfortunately, another source, I abhore. I am more inclined to show James'
wife as Sibylla dtr. of Sir Walter and Elizabeth Merbury.

>
>
>
> This article shows no light on John Touchet, 4th or 6th Lord Audley, as
> Elizabeth is only mentioned as daughter of John Touchet, Lord Audley.
> However, the dates for Elizabeth's husband seem to confirm the link with the
> 4th Lord as Sir John Baskerville was born 12 February 1403 and died 23
> December 1455 and his brother-in-law, James, 5th Lord Audley, was born circa
> 1398.
>
> This article throws up another question. John Steele Gordon gives Elizabeth
> Parry as wife of Sir Walter Baskerville,
> Kay Allen points out it could be Elsbeth ferch Morgan.
> Burke's landed Gentry gives two wives for Sir Walter,
> Anne daughter of Morgan ap Jenkin ap Philip, of Pencoyd,
> and second wife Elizabeth daughter of Henry ap Milo ap Harry of Poston.

Let's leave Burke alone on this and just leave it that it is currently under
investigation.

>
>
> Sadly, Sir Walter's son Thomas (by the first wife) is only recorded as
> Thomas, of Pontrilas, without any further details.

Even Rev. Robinson contradicts himself on which wife was Thomas' mother. This
is still up for grabs.

>
> Can anyone throw any further light on these discrepancies?

I hope this helps some. I have ordered wills that I hope will shed more light
on the accuracy
and timing of this pedigree.

Kay Allen AG

>
> Best wishes
> Leo van de Pas

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