Archiver > GEN-MEDIEVAL > 2002-07 > 1027163138

From: Cristopher Nash <>
Subject: Re: de Thouars and de Faye (Bramley, Surrey) in 'DD' - ?
Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 12:05:38 +0100
References: <>
In-Reply-To: <>

Dear John,

Just back from Greece and several weeks behind, here, I'm just
wondering. I've a rich file, tho not necessarily in texture, of our
exchanges of last autumn re Braose/Wingfield/Faye et al. Does the
RTF you mention postdate your generational posting of say 27 Nov
2001,<Re: Raoul de Faye->Ralph de Fay>? If so and if at all
convenient, I'd love to have a copy - any chance? I recall having
ended with some leftover discomfort concerning the precise relats
betw Ralph of Bramley and Raoul of Faye-la-Vineuse, and am hoping
your/Rosie's later work resolves it!



>Friday, 28 June, 2002
>Dear Adrian,
> Thanks for your detailed reply to my earlier post.
> Two issues I note in the 3rd and 4th generations as shown in your post:
> 1. Based on the chronology of the period, I agree
> with Rosie Bevan's suggestion in an earlier
> post that was probably an additional generation
> (2.A. ?), with Ralph de Faye, son of #1 Raoul and
> father of #2 Ralph (d. 1223), who was the
> individual restored to his father's lands in
> Bramley, Surrey by King John (charter dated
> 4 Dec 1199).
> [see prior SGM threads <Clere/Fay/Rus/Turnham>
> ca. 8 Feb 1999, by Richard Borthwick and
> others; also John Carmi Parsons, <Raoul/Ralph
> de Fay> ca. 6 Feb 1999]
> 2. Maud de Clere, nee de Fay, sister and coheiress
> of her brother John de Fay, is not the same as
> Maud de Clare, wife of William de Braose of
> Bramber and Gower (d. 1210).
> Maud de Clare was the daughter of Richard de
> Clare, 4th Earl of Hertford and MC Surety
> (d. bef 28 Nov 1217) and his wife Amicia,
> Countess of Gloucester ( 1 Jan 1224/5).
> Best reference re: above, see CP under Braose
> or Brewes (also, MC 5th edition).
> I am sending you by separate attachment the 7 generation .rtf file I
>previously sent to Chris (Phillips) and Rosie (Bevan). This provides the
>sources (SGM and elsewhere) for the relationships reflected.
> Please let me know of any corrections or questions that you may note.
> Best regards,
> John *
>* John P. Ravilious


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