GEN-MEDIEVAL-L ArchivesArchiver > GEN-MEDIEVAL > 2002-07 > 1027467325
From: "Stewart, Peter" <>
Subject: RE: Dampierre-Richebourg
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 09:41:54 +1000
> -----Original Message-----
> From: B.M. Kamp [mailto:]
> Sent: Wednesday, 24 July 2002 6:33
> To: Stewart, Peter;
> Subject: Re: Dampierre-Richebourg
> Peter Stewart wrote:
> Subject: Dampierre-Richebourg
> > This tight chronology isn't impossible, of course, but
> > suspicious to me especially as Alix's purported mother
> > Béatrix of Putten had no heirs by her first marriage
> > and yet neither Alix nor any of her children is stated to
> > have inherited Putten & Strijen from her.
> I have come across this problem some years ago. The only logical
> conclusion seemed to me to be that's Alix was a child of her fathers
> first marriage with Marie d'Enghien. Later on I discovered
> that al least two authors support my conclusion:
> 1. The famous Belgian genealogist Lefort. I do not know when
> he lived, but his handwritten tables were pulished in facsimile in the
> years 1980. Lefort says that Alix was a daughter of Guy by his first wife.
> 2. The also "famous" F.C. Butkens (famous for his falsified genealogy
> of the Aspremont-Lynden, 1626). Marie d'Enghien is mentioned as
> mother of Alix in his "Trophées tant sacrés et profanes du Duché de
> Brabant" published 1724/1726. As far as I know his "trophées" is a
> honest publication.
> I do not know who firstly invented the marriage with Isabelle of Bar.
> George Poull " La maison souveraine et ducale de Bar" Nancy 1994
> states she died unmarried.
> Note that the chronological problems disappear under this solution.
> Note also that Alix first daughter was named Marie and that
> there is no Beatrix among her children.
A similar reservation occurred to me over this as with Béatrix of Putten &
Strijen: Guy's first wife Marie d'Enghien was burggravine of Ghent and dame
of Zotteghem & Houdain. Do you know what became of these titles? There is no
obvious problem if these passed to offspring of her first marriage, to
Hugues V d'Antoing, seigneur of Epinoy - I've never seen them ascribed to
Alix of any of her children. If Alix had half-siblings, or just one, I
suppose proof of her immediate relationships could be looked for in that