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From: "Boulus ad-Darwin" <darwin+>
Subject: Re: From Muhammad the Prophet to Idris I of Morocco
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 00:59:02 +0100
References: <opsfmlxql0s240kh@paulo> <000001c4ae5d$6451f1e0$c3b4fea9@email>


On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 00:06:01 +0000 (UTC), "Leo van de Pas"
<> wrote:

> Dear Darwin,
> First, E. de Zambour, "Manuel de Genealogie et de Chronologie, pour
> l'Histoire de Islam", published in 1927 and reprinted in 1976, how
> reliable
> is this work?

Hello Leo,

I'm not an expert in genealogy, I just do it amateurishly in my free time,
as I love family stories ever since I was a child, and this way I can join
it with another of my pleasures, History.
I don't know this book, but it sounds tremendously interesting, especially
if it includes the Caliphate of Cordoba (does it?). But even if I knew it
I couldn't give you an expert opinion on its reliability.

> You make Idriss I a king of Morocco. The above mentioned book also calls
> him
> Idriss I, but in a footnote it tells that by his concubine, Kanza, he was
> father of Idriss II, first Idrissid souvereign of Morocco.

I've seen the history of the Idrisside family here:
http://membres.lycos.fr/andalus/info/les_idrissides_dans_le_maghreb_a.htm

It doesn't have a very pretty start, since Idris was one of the few
survivers of his family, massacred by the Abassides in Kufa and other
parts of Iraq. Then he fled to Morocco where he was received by the
Aourebas tribe, marrying one of his daughters, being then elected by the
Berbers as King of Morocco.
There are many parallels between him and the Ummyad Abd al-Rahman, founder
of the Cordoba independent Emirate - both were persecuted by the Abassides
and had their family slaught, both flew to Morocco and were received by
the Berber, bot were founders of royal dinasties - so, despite their
families have been enemies in the past, strong bonds must have been formed
between the 2 houses of Cordoba and Morocco.

Anyway, I don't know for sure if Idris I was really a King or just a
chieftain like Pelayo de Astúrias.

> This book has a family tree which covers descendants (in the male line)
> of
> the grandfather of Idriss I. Sadly, for me, the line displayed by
> Saissi
> Elhassan, stops by Abdallah, son of Idriss II. It has a footnote telling
> he
> is the ancestor of the Imghariun family.

I wonder if one could find some Morocan/Algerian genealogist...
I've another reason to be interested on that area, since perthaps,
somewhere there in their archives are the codices of marriages,
christenings and deaths of Porto Santo (Portuguese Island) stolen by
Algerian Pirates in the XVII century. It would be fabulous if those books
could be found and microfilmed to complete our archives, since I guess
almost every Porto Santo genealogy is stopping there, including one of my
family branches.
I have "close" ancestors (6th grandfather and others) from Morocco, but as
they were captives I guess I'll never know who they really were.
Portuguese nobility had this nasty habit of giving *their* names to their
slaves, so this one is Pedro de Canha, slave of the good priest Francisco
de Canha. *sigh*.

Cheers,

Paulo

--
-darwin-

"I don't care if we're holding 15,000 innocent people. We're winning the
war."
-- Gen. Wodjakowski to Gen. Karpinski, referring to Abu Graib

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