GEN-MEDIEVAL-L ArchivesArchiver > GEN-MEDIEVAL > 2005-09 > 1126982806
From: "Chris Bennett" <>
Subject: Re: Turkish Question
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 18:46:46 GMT
Further to this, there is more information on Christopher Buyer's Royal Ark
He identifies Huma as "daughter of 'Abdu'llah and a relative of George
Balsha, Prince of Zeta (Montenegro)" He does not further identify
"Abd'ullah". He says Murad II had 6 sons and 2 daughters, but goes on to
name 9 sons and 5 daughters.
I give you this for what it may be worth. Although I have no reason to
doubt it, I also can't tell you where he gets it from, or how reliable it
is. The trouble with Buyer's site is that, while he gives an overall set of
sources for his genealogies, which certainly look very impressive, he never
annotates specific statements. In my experience, which I am told is not
unique, he gets rather shirty if asked specific questions about specific
"Chris Bennett" <> wrote in message news:...
> Leo --
> If you are interested in Ottoman genealogy, a more recent, and I think
> much better source, giving wives, is A D Alderson, The Structure of the
> Ottoman Dynasty (Oxford, 1956)
> According to Alderson the mother of Mehmed II is named in an inscription
> at Bursa as Huma, of unknown ancestry. He knows of 13 children for Murad
> II, including 7 daughters, only one of whom (Fatma) is named.
> He doesn't know a "Khadidja bint Isfendiar" as one of Murad's wives, but
> he does know a "Hadice (Khadidja) bint Ibrahim Candaroglu" -- but this
> must be a different woman because he says that Zambaur gives her father as
> ""Leo van de Pas"" <> wrote in message
>> In E de Zambaur's "Manuel de Genealogie et de Chronologie Pour l'Histoire
>> de l'Islam" is a collection of familytrees. There is one dedicated to the
>> Ottoman Sultans of Turkey.
>> Like many Muslim familytrees, wives are basically missing. However, there
>> are footnotes.
>> By Sultan Murad II, he was Sultan from 1421 to 1444 and from 1446 till he
>> died in 1451, is a footnote : Khadidja bint Isfendiar i.Bayazid , mere de
>> Muhammed II. (this is not in the footnote, but he is also known as Mehmed
>> Murad II has been given seven children and the last two seem to be girls,
>> and amongst these children is Muhammed II. In this lineage also appear
>> two Sultans Bayazid, I and II. Bayazid I is the grandfather of Murad II
>> and Bayazid II is a son of Muhammed II.
>> Does anyone understand what the footnote is indicating? Does bint mean
>> child of? Is Khadidja a daughter of a Isfendiar and is he the son of a
>> Bayazid? Whether it is Sultan Bayazid I is another question.
>> I have (few) descendants but they go to the 20th century.
>> Many thanks.
>> Leo van de Pas
>> Canberra, Australia