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From:
Subject: Re: Gilbert fitzreinfrid son and Heir...Christina &Ivo
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2005 17:19:44 EST



In a message dated 11/25/2005 5:11:11 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, WJhonson
writes:

OK its been very confusing. YOU posted about someone having a child William
at 15 and giving a specific year for that possible event, thus stating a
claim to the birthyear of the father. Now isn't' this Orm the brother of that
William?


Dear Will,

Ketel was the father of William [ his eldest son] and Orm. Orm [the younger
son] witnessed a charter of Roger de Poictevin in 1094 [Farrer, Pipe Rolls of
Lancashire, pp. 289-290]. To be a witness to this charter Orm must have at
least 14 years of age. That means Orm was born by 1080 to be at least 14 in
1094. William who was Orm's older brother had to be at least a year older
making him born at least by 1079. If we use these years to try and arrive at a
birth year for their father Ketel it would be unlikely that Ketel sired a
child before he was 15 years of age. If Ketel were 15 when William was born using
the date above then Ketel was born before 1064 [ 1079 -15 years].

I was trying to establish the latest possible date at which Ketel could have
been born. So from documented sources Ketel had to be born in 1064 or
before.

I hope this makes sense.

MichaelAnne

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