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Archiver > GEN-MEDIEVAL > 2007-05 > 1178596725


From: "John Higgins" <>
Subject: Re: Descents From Edward III For Dr. William Brigham,Discoverer of Whittle Springs 1845
Date: Mon, 7 May 2007 20:58:45 -0700
References: <1177287827.427413.116610@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com><1178571605.738365.302350@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>


This is another interesting and useful descent. I believe I can provide an
11th Joan Beaufort descent for Dr. William Brigham, and I have a couple of
questions on the Lumley connection.

Elizabeth Ferrers, Lady Greystoke, also had a daughter Elizabeth who mar.
Roger Thornton of Newcastle. This couple had a daughter Elizabeth who mar.
George, Lord Lumley [see CP 8:273-4]. Their son Thomas was the one who is
said to have mar. Elizabeth, the illegitimate dau. of Edward IV.

The statement that the wife of Roger Lumley of Ludworth was Isabel Ratcliffe
is interesting. Leo's Genealogics database gives this wife for Roger, but
neither of the sources he cites for Roger (Paget and Burke's Extinct
Peerages) give Roger a wife, and no source is given for Isabel. In addition
Leo gives a wife Isabelle [sic] Ratcliffe to Roger's uncle, another Roger,
citing in this case Cahiers de St. Louis. But a detailed Lumley pedigree in
Surtees' Durham, 2:163, gives no wives for either of the Rogers. Is there a
good source for this Isabel?

Also, pedigrees for both the Lumley and Trollope families indicate that the
Lumley daughter who mar. Thomas Trollope was Margaret, not Anne (who mar.
John Lambton).

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brad Verity" <>
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
To: <>
Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 2:00 PM
Subject: Re: Descents From Edward III For Dr. William Brigham,Discoverer of
Whittle Springs 1845


> On Apr 22, 5:23 pm, Brad Verity <> wrote:
>
> > Dr.Brigham was able to buy some land back in Brighamand erect a monument
to the family's origins. His 7 descents
> > from Joan Beaufort are as follows.
>
> Dr. Brigham actually had 10 descents from Joan Beaufort, including one
> thru Edward IV (Line I below). The additional descents are the
> following, with Line G from the original post now Line H.
>
> Joan Beaufort, Countess of Westmorland (c.1379-1440), had 1 son (J1)
> and 4 daughters (A1, B1, F1 & I1)
>
> F1) Elizabeth Ferrers, Lady Greystoke (1393-1434), who had (with H2
> below)
> F2) Ralph, 5th Lord Greystoke (c.1414-1487), who had (with G3 below)
> F3) Sir Robert Greystoke (d. 1483) m. 1) Elizabeth Grey (see E3
> above)
>
> G3) Elizabeth Greystoke (d. 1490) m. 1) Thomas, 5th Lord Scrope of
> Masham (c.1430-1475), and had
> G4) Margery Scrope (d. aft. 1531) m. 1493 Sir Christopher Danby of
> Thorpe Perrow (d. 1518), and had
> G5) Sir Christopher Danby of Thorpe Perrow (1503-1571) m. Elizabeth
> Nevill (see J4 below) and had
> G6) Margaret Danby (c.1525-15--) m. Christopher Hopton of Armley Hall,
> Yorks. (d. 1585), and had
> G7) Susan Hopton m. Thomas Wentworth of Whitley, Yorks. (1542-15--),
> and had
> G8) Michael Wentworth of Woolley, Yorks. (d. 1641) m. 1585 Frances
> Downes (d. by 1639), and had
> G9) Mary Wentworth (liv. 1660) m. 1611 Richard Langley of Millington
> (see I9 below), and had
> G10) Ursula Langley m. William Brigham of Brigham (see A10 above)
>
> H2) Eleanor Greystoke m. Sir Ralph Eure of Witton Castle (d. 1461),
> and had
> H3) Sir William Eure of Witton (1440-1484) m. Margaret Constable, and
> had
> H4) Sir Ralph Eure of Witton (d. 1540) m. 2)1516 Agnes Constable, and
> had
> H5) Joan Eure (c.1516-15-) m. 1)1530 Henry Pudsey of Barforth
> (1514-1533), and had
> H6) Thomas Pudsey of Barforth (1531-1576) m. c.1555 Elizabeth Scrope
> (see C7 above)
>
> I1) Cecily Nevill, Duchess of York (1415-1495), who had
> I2) Edward IV, King of England (1442-1483), who had
> I3) Elizabeth 'Plantagenet' (illeg.) m. Sir Thomas Lumley, and had
> I4) Roger Lumley of Ludworth m. Isabel Ratcliffe, and had
> I5) Anne Lumley m. Anthony Trollope of Thornley, co. Durham, and had
> I6) John Trollope of Thornley m. Maud Metham, and had
> I7) Margaret Trollope m. John Rudston of Hayton, Yorks. (d. 1597), and
> had
> I8) Ursula Rudston m. 1)Christopher Langley of Millington, Yorks.
> (1565-1592), and had
> I9) Richard Langley of Millington (d. 1628) m. 1611 Mary Wentworth
> (see G9 above)
>
> J1) George Nevill, 1st Lord Latimer (c.1411-1469), who had
> J2) Sir Henry Nevill (d. 1469) m. Joan Bourchier (d. 1470, descended
> from Edward III but not thru Joan Beaufort), and had
> J3) Richard Nevill, 2nd Lord Latimer (1468-1530) m. 1)1483 Anne
> Stafford, and had
> J4) Elizabeth Nevill (1500-15-) m. Sir Christopher Danby of Thorpe
> Perrow (see G5 above)
>
> Cheers, ----Brad
>
>
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