GEN-MEDIEVAL-L ArchivesArchiver > GEN-MEDIEVAL > 2008-03 > 1205129806
Subject: Re: Sir Paunettus, kinsman to Edward the Black Prince: Clue to ancestry of Paonet de Ruet?
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 23:16:46 -0700 (PDT)
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I believe that the Braddy piece has since been discredited with
respect to 'Philippa, daughter of Panetto' or whatever it was (sorry;
I do have the article -- a printout of microfiche no less! -- but not
handy). (Okay, it helps to actually re-read your post as you yourself
suggest -- you've got the title right there in front of me!) :-/
I think Braddy's position was that Panetto referred to Philippa
Chaucer's father's position as manager of the pantry or stores (or,
was it that Philippa Pan* referred to HER being the mistress of the
pantry?), with the Pan* being an abbreviation for something like
On the first argument (which she may not have made herself; can't
recall -- read it more than 20 years ago), one could perhaps justify
by the readings of the Cartulaire of the Counts of Hainault in which
it would seem that Paon/Gilles held the possibly hereditary position
of 'manager of the household' (and if you would like me to quote it
verbatim with reference, I can do that, possibly tomorrow after I get
off work but more probably later in the week), but I believe that the
Philippa Pan*/Philippa le Picarde theory is no longer in vogue.
As for cosanguinity (why cannot I spell properly at 11 at night?!),
the only marital impediment mentioned in the papal dispensation for
the marriage of John of Gaunt and Katherine Roet Swynford is that of
Gaunt's being a godfather to a child of Katherine's.
Have I missed something? Any thoughts, anyone?
> For more particulars regarding Paonet/Paonnet de Ruet, newsgroup
> readers might wish to read two interesting article in print. The
> first article is by Haldeen Braddy entitled "Chaucer's Philippa,
> Daughter of Panneto " in Modern Language Notes, Vol. 64, No. 5 (May,
> 1949), pp. 342-343. The second article is by Margaret Galway entitled
> ""Philippa Pan., Philippa Chaucer," in Modern Language Rev. (1960):
> As far as it goes, there is nothing whatsoever known which would
> contradict the Ruet family from being near related to Edward the Black
> Prince's mother, Philippe of Hainault, certainly within the 5th
> degree. In fact, it has been theorized that the Ruet family is a
> branch of the Roeulx family, which family is believed to have been a
> cadet branch of the Counts of Hainault.