Archiver > GEN-MEDIEVAL > 2010-04 > 1271088291

From: Renia <>
Subject: Re: Palliser
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2010 19:18:43 +0300
References: <><hpuog4$mc9$><><hpvg3m$9qc$><>
In-Reply-To: <>

Nathaniel Taylor wrote:
> In article <hpvg3m$9qc$>,
> Renia <> wrote:
>> Matt Tompkins wrote:
>>> On Apr 12, 10:17 am, Renia <> wrote:
>>>> My main area of interest, at the moment, is how the Palliser (Palicer,
>>>> etc) surname moved from Languedoc and/or Catalonia to the manor of
>>>> Wakefield in Yorkshire by 1315.
>>> Renia, are you discounting all possibility that the surname arose
>>> independently in the two locations? Surely it is possible, even
>>> probable, that there is no connection between the Yorkshire Pallisers
>>> and those in Langudoc/Catalonia?
>> There are more Pallisers in Spain than there are in England, of that
>> spelling. Pelissier abounds in France, but during the medieval period,
>> assorted spellings were around. I have not found one Palliser in England
>> prior to 1315, nor even a remote variant of it. Besides, the family in
>> the Languedoc shares the coat of arms of the Pallisers of Yorkshire.
> That's interesting -- are the arms attested that early (14th c.) for
> both families? And where was the family in Languedoc?
> As it's an essentially occupational surname, the default assumption
> would be that those who used it in different locales were unlikely to be
> related, but the use of arms may link the two families -- essentially
> tradespeople made good, early, and established as armigerous in both
> England and Plantagenet Guyenne during the Hundred Years' War?

It's long been held to have been an occupational surname, but I think
that is an error. In England, the origins are within a 30-mile radius,
and the same was true even early in the 20th century, notwithstanding
those who drifted in and out of London. This suggests a common origin
for English Pallisers, rather than one actually springing from a "maker
of palings and fences". The occupational word was still used in the 16th
century, and the earliest "palisers" I have found, already had other

In Spain, the occupational word derives from someone who works with furs
or pelts.

The Pallicers in Langedoc came from Castres, near Albi, and had a
castle, according to internet sources. They escaped from the
Albingensian Crusade, and settled in Catalonia. However, some seem to
have stayed in the Castres area.

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