Archiver > GEN-MEDIEVAL > 2010-11 > 1290901614

From: "Peter Stewart" <>
Subject: Re: Agatha de Hommet
Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 10:46:54 +1100
References: <><ib9m11$123$><ibndug$ikq$><><ichre0$o48$><icnk3c$11q$><>
In-Reply-To: <>

"John P. Ravilious" <> wrote in message


> It is widely held that Richard du Hommet predeceased his father,
> with his (alleged) brother William succeeding as Constable of
> Normandy.

The first part is correct - Richard did die before his father William. I'm
not sure that the second part was ever "widely held", since there are
several charters of the younger William du Hommet referring to Richard's
father William as his own grandfather, for instance one dated 1213 for the
chapel of Saint Catherine at La Perrine which later became a priory founded
by his second wife Eustachia of Montenay ("Willelmus de Humeto,
conestabularius, avus meus").

> This would appear to make sense, as it is printed in Bain
> concerning the marriage of Clemence de Fougeres to Ranulf,
> Earl of Chester that 'William de Humez owes 75 marks for
> marrying his niece to the Earl of Chester' [Bain, CDS I:63,
> cites Pipe Roll 7 John, Rot. 18, dorso].

I can't be certain what Bain had in mind, but the more widely held
misunderstanding is that Clemence was niece rather than granddaughter of the
older William, i.e. that her mother Agatha was his sister rather than his
daughter, as stated by Keats-Rohan and discussed earlier in this thread.


> Notes:
> [1] Notice sur les attaches d'un sceau de Richard Coeur de Lion, in
> Bibliotheque de l'Ecole des Chartes (Paris: J. B. DuMoulin, 1853), 3rd
> ser., IV:60, note 4. This charter was evidently extracted from
> Stapleton, Magni rotuli Scaccarii Normanniae, vol. I, p. cxlv.

No, a copy of this charter was provided to Delisle by Charles de Gerville
("La charte suivante, dont je dois la copie à M. de Gerville..."). The
reference to Stapleton is for the statement that Henry II granted Varreville
and Poupeville to Richard de la Haye - on the page specified Stapleton
wrote: "Richard de Humeto was dead before 1213, and probably in the lifetime
of his father, as his son William describes himself 'Guillelmus de Humeto,
Constabularius Normanniæ, filius Richardi de Humeto, junioris'; in right of
his mother he succeeded to Varanguebecq and numerous fiefs in the Côtentin
of the succession of the barony of Haye-de-puits".

Peter Stewart

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