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From: Brad Verity <>
Subject: Re: Marriage of Elizabeth (Woodville) Grey and Edward IV (about 1464)
Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 22:55:08 -0700 (PDT)
References: <mailman.5.1305653411.27500.gen-medieval@rootsweb.com><2712a0f3-3e52-4ab2-961f-96a09faca0ae@18g2000prd.googlegroups.com><mailman.12.1305682126.27500.gen-medieval@rootsweb.com><8b05c689-128d-43e7-89a8-5af4c6b41039@cu4g2000vbb.googlegroups.com>


On May 17, 8:39 pm, Cochoit <> wrote:

> I believe Brad meant to say that the ‘Privy purse expenses of
> Elizabeth of York’ places her birth at 11 February 1464/5 with the
> note that Sandford said 11 February 1466.

> The reference is available online:
> Privy purse expenses of Elizabeth of York : wardrobe accounts of
> Edward the Fourth. With a Memoir of Elizabeth of York, and Notes
> (1830)http://www.archive.org/stream/privypurseexpens00nicouoft#page/n43/mod...

Thanks for the link, Joe. I actually was going by the RIII Society
transcription of 'Privy Purse', at the following link:

http://www.r3.org/bookcase/wardrobe/ward3.html

There her birthdate is mis-transcribed as "11th of February, 1463-4".
So that explains one discrepancy.

> I would also point out that on page xvii states that Sandford had the
> order of the children wrong, and that the second child of Edward IV,
> Mary of York, was born August 1466 making it impossible for Elizabeth
> to have been born in February 1466.

The entry below is from William of Worcester, the Yorkist annalist
from the fifteenth century. He's the source for most of the dates of
birth for the Yorkist dynasty:

“Anno Domini m.cccc.lxv., et anno regni regis Edwardi Quarti quinto.
Mense Februarii apud Westmonasterium regina Elizabetha peperit filiam
primogenitam cui nomen imposuerunt Elizabetham; cujus compatres
fuerunt in baptismo comes Warrwici, ducissae Eboraci et Bedfordiae, et
ad confirmationem ducissa Bukes.” [William of Worcester, 'Annales
Rerum Anglicarum' in "Letters and Papers Illustrative of the Wars of
the English in France During the Reign of Henry the Sixth, King of
England", Volume II, Part II (Rolls Series 22: 1864), p. 785.]

The fifth regnal year of Edward IV went from 4 March 1465 to 3 March
1466, so it looks as if she was born 11 February 1465-6. From the
same source and edition as above, we have this about the birth of the
next daughter, Mary (p. 788):

“Anno Domini m.cccc.lxvij., et anno regis Edwardi Quarti septimo ...
die Augusti regina Elizabetha peperit aliam filiam apud Wyndesore,
nomine Mariam, cujus compatres fucrunt in baptismo archiepiscopus
Cantuariae.”

August of the seventh regnal year of Edward IV was 1467, not 1466. So
it appears Nicolas in 'Privy Purse' made another birthdate error when
he said Mary of York was born in August 1466. Curiously, he cites
"Annals of William of Worcester" as his source. But Nicolas was
working from an earlier edition of Worcester, as he wrote 'Privy
Purse' 34 years before the publication of the Rolls Series Worcester
edition I quoted from above. I'll warrant that earlier printed
Worcester contained many dating errors, as whoever edited it seemed to
have miscalculated Edward IV's regnal years.

Cheers, ------Brad



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