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From:
Subject: GENBRIT-D Digest V97 #110
------------------------------
Content-Type: text/plain
GENBRIT-D DigestVolume 97 : Issue 110
Today's Topics:
#1 mid 1800's Colonial Office ["Paul J. Rands" <>]
#2 Althrop [Judith Zander <]
#3 Re: Ninian Stewart [ (mary stewart kyri]
#4 Re: Christmas Day [ (mary stewart kyri]
#5 Certificates [ (Ray ]
#6 Re: MILITARY BADGE ["Steve Burton" <.]
#7 BURDIKIN/BURDAKIN []
#8 SHIPS : Berwick Coaster [Tim <>]
#9 Been to Suffolk Surname List site [ (LeeAnn)]
#10 Co. Durham 1871 Census ["Andrew Smith" <>]
#11 alt.family-names.* FAQ now posted []
#12 Re: FHSocieties - Scotland [Anna Smart <.]
#13 Re: WHERE IS DUNTS HILL, WANDSWORT [Mike Lillington <]
#14 Re: Need Help [Barney Tyrwhitt-Drake <]
#15 Micklethwaite [m12 <>]
#16 Re: Occupation : Hind. ? ["David Nutt" <>]
#17 Re: King James the 1st of Scotland [john[no_spam]@[no_spam]vetchfield.]
#18 Re: Phone book lookup Banchory []
#19 Re: IGI: Squire Squire, and simila [ (Re]
#20 Re: Help in Croydon [Chris Caley <.]
#21 Re: Military insignia [ (Forres]
#22 Re: Lucton public school, Hereford [ (Forres]
#23 Pigot's Commercial Directory for K []
#24 Re: Christmas Day : 7th January [Stuart Cresswell <stuart.cresswell]
#25 Re: King James the 1st of Scotland [Stuart Cresswell <stuart.cresswell]
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______________________________
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X-Message: #1
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 09:26:34 -0700
From: "Paul J. Rands" <>
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: mid 1800's Colonial Office
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I believe my ancestors Joseph William Rands and wife Sarah Rodia
Anderson emigrated to Cape Town from England in 1847/48 under a program
in which they received free ship's passage if they were in certain labor
categories. They would have traveled in the ship Scotia (Dec 1847) or
the ship Coromandel (Feb 1848). I've read about this program in an
announcement on the front page of the London Times published daily from
Sept 1847 through January 1848. It appears several hundred people,
including some Irish, took advantage of this program.
I have not been able to prove they were in this program. I've tried to
find a ship's passenger list for those two ships but have not succeeded
yet, even with help of contacts in Cape Town.
My next move is to see if the old Colonial Office that probably
supervised this program has any records about who went. Does anyone
know if one can access old Colonial office records and where and how?
My brother will be in London in mid October and has volunteered to do
the searching if I can find out where to send him.
Any other ideas would be welcome.
Paul Rands near Portland, Oregon, USA
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X-Message: #2
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 08:11:51 -0400
From: Judith Zander <>
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Althrop
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Hi All;
Does anyone know why Princess Diana's brother left England & what he
works at in South Africa? Who lives on the family estate now?
Just curious.
--
Judy Zander, London, Ontario, Canada
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X-Message: #3
Date: 26 Sep 1997 10:47:45 -0700
From: (mary stewart kyritsis)
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Re: Ninian Stewart
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
In message <>
(MRS CAROL ALBRECHT) writes:
> Can anyone tell me who the children of King James the 1st of Scotland
> are? Does anyone reconize the name of Ninian Stewart? Thank you...
> Carol
Ninian Stewart was an important name in the early settlement of Stewarts in
the parish of Ballintoy, in Co. Antrim, Northern Ireland. They came from
the Isle of Bute, and the name continued down through several generations.
The first instance of the name, according to the Stewart Clan Magazine (page
B30 - issue of Feb 1928) was Ninian, son of James Stewart, keeper of Rothsay
castle, who succeeded his father in 1490. He was made hereditary castellar
of Rothsay by James IV in 1498. The family descends from King Robert II
through one of his numerous sons named John, offspring of his liaison with
Christian Leitch of Bute.
Ninian's seventh child was again named Ninian, and given lands in Perthshire
and Arran. This Ninian's son Archibald Stewart became one of the leaders in
the rebellion organized in 1544 by Matthew Stuart, earl of Lennox, in
opposition to the regency of Arran, during the minority of Mary Stuart, at
the instigatiion of King Henry VIII of England. For this he forfeited his
lands in 1546 and in 1559 when the last of his property was sold, he moved
to Ireland, settling in Co. Antrim in a place called Dunseverick but later
moved to Ballinstraid {Straidh} in Ballintoy parish. This was of course
long before the Plantation of Ulster. There is a certain amount of
speculation that later descendants of this family came to America, settling
in New Jersey.
To get back to your original question, the children of James I of Scotland
were Margaret, Elizabeth, Jean, James (became James II), Alexander (d.y.),
Eleanor, Mary and Arabella. There is something in O'Hart's Irish Pedigress
(I:265) to the effect that he had a son Ninian as well, but Hart must be
treated with caution, especially in what he says about the Stewarts. Ninian
has not been found anywhere else.
Hope this helps.
Regards,
Mary in Greece
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X-Message: #4
Date: 26 Sep 1997 10:47:45 -0700
From: (mary stewart kyritsis)
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Re: Christmas Day
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hello all,
In Greece, although the official Orthodox Church celebrates Christmas on
25th December, there is a group of people who follow the old calendar -
paleoimerologites - who have their Christmas on 6th January. An old auntie
in my husband's family followed this calendar, and when Christmas came she
was still fasting for Advent. It made feeding her at the festive board
something of a challenge!
regards,
Mary in Greece
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X-Message: #5
Date: 26 Sep 1997 10:52:19 -0700
From: (Ray Hamblett)
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Certificates
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Has anybody thought how much easier life would be easier if more
information was given on the various certificates of Birth, Marriage
and Death?
Im not an experienced Genealogist but would'nt it be better if a birth
certificate included details from the parents birth certificate,
equally a marriage certificate could carry details from each partners
parents certificates.
It might not need to be all the details but just a reference number.
In this age of digital technology it shouldnt be so difficult to
record this additional information, it isnt going to help us find our
ancestors but it might help our descendents find us!
What do you think- Anybody -Barney TD, Am I talking out the back of my
head, I don't know - tell me.
"Curiosity is the first step to growth....."
======================================================
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X-Message: #6
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 17:46:49 GMT
From: "Steve Burton" <>
To:
Message-ID: <01bccaa4$2b4dd660$>
Subject: Re: MILITARY BADGE
Well, I know that "Bantams" were raised in Britain of men who had failed
the army height requirement, but were keen to serve. The B.C. on the badge
must surely stand for the province of British Columbia. I suggest you
investigate this link:
http://actcorp.com/authors/Allinson/Bantams.html
This website relates to the only history available on the Bantams, to my
knowledge. The fellow who wrote the book was most helpful to me, just
e-mail him with your questions. I think you'll find the whole story very
touching, and rather tragic.
regards,
Steve Burton
wrote in article
<>...
> Any military buffs there who could identify a Canadian badge please. I
> believe the badge was my grandfather's brother's from W.W.I. The general
> shape is a Canadian Maple with a Bantam in the centre. A motto which
extends
> on either side of the bantam reads " MULTUM INPARVO ". Below this is the
> inscription
> " B.C. BANTAMS " below that the figure " 143 " and, at the bottom, "
CANADA
> ". All this is surmounted by the inscription " OVERSEAS " and a crown.
Could
> someone please identify the Regiment and, if possible, where the
Regimental
> records would be located.
>
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> Derek Porter
>
> Simo's town
>
> South Africa
>
>
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X-Message: #7
Date: 26 Sep 1997 11:29:18 -0700
From:
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: BURDIKIN/BURDAKIN
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
A friend (not on internet) is trying to trace her paternal lineage.
Evidently, the family lived in Edale for several generations, but did not
originate there. It's believed they moved across Europe to England in the
late 1300's.
If anyone recognizes the name and can tell me what they know, my friend
would both appreciate it tremendously.
Thanks,
KJB
BC Canada
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X-Message: #8
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 19:28:00 +0100
From: Tim <>
To:
Message-ID: <4Ix5FDAw6$>
Subject: SHIPS : Berwick Coaster
One of my ancestors was master mariner of a Berwick Coaster owned by the
Berwick Shipping Company. It was a sailing ship with a tonnage of 126
tons and was built in Aberdeen in 1847 (named 'Thames').
Does anyone know roughly what size this vessel would be, or have any
other relevant information ?
--
Tim
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X-Message: #9
Date: 26 Sep 1997 11:34:09 -0700
From: (LeeAnn)
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Been to Suffolk Surname List site lately?
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
For those who haven't been to the Suffolk Surname List lately (URL below)
you may want to stop by. Now online:
Surname List
How to submit your interests
Bounced & removed email addresses
Suffolk maps and files
One name parish records
Suffolk Mailing List subscribe instructions
Suffolk Church pictures
England Look Up Exchange, Suffolk page
All Suffolk Links
form to search RSL for Suffolk name
Guest book
Of course none of this would be possilbe without the input of all my fellow
researchers. Church pictures, one name parish records, URLs, submissions
and any other input is always welcome and appreciated.
Happy hunting
LeeAnn
Ontario, Canada
E-mail: beerdl@<REMOVE NO SPAM>kos.net
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
{ Researching my family's history: }
{ http://www.visualcreations.com/pers/leeann/genealogy/ }
{ WHATLING Family History, a one name study }
{ http://www.visualcreations.com/pers/leeann/whatling/ }
{ Suffolk Surname Interest List (U.K.): }
{ http://www.visualcreations.com/pers/leeann/suffolk/ }
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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X-Message: #10
Date: 26 Sep 1997 18:47:18 GMT
From: "Andrew Smith" <>
To:
Message-ID: <01bccaad$41c95dc0$>
Subject: Co. Durham 1871 Census
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Does anyone have access to the 1871 census for Haswell Moor County Durham?
If so we would be eternally grateful if you could look up the following
family for us:
DEVLIN, John age 43, Mason? (possibly miner)
DEVLIN, Daniel age 16. Miner, son of John
DEVLIN, James age 17, Miner, son of John
We are particularly interested in place of birth for John and anyone else
living in the same household.
Andrew and Diana Smith
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X-Message: #11
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 13:52:40 -0600
From:
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: alt.family-names.* FAQ now posted at my Genealogy Infocenter site
I have now added, as promised, a FAQ for the alt.family-names.* newsgroup
hierarchy. You can view it at:
http://members.tripod.com/~Genealogy_Infocenter/altfnfaq.html
James W. Anderson
http://members.tripod.com/~Genealogy_Infocenter/index.html
The Genealogy Infocenter: Newsgroup FAQs, Internet Communications Tools.
The FamilySearch FAQ, and more!
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
______________________________
------------------------------
X-Message: #12
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 20:16:34 -0700
From: Anna Smart <>
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Re: FHSocieties - Scotland
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The Scottish Genealogy Socity & Scottish Association of Family History
Societies can be found at
http://www.taynet.co.uk/users/scotgensoc/
The link was on GENUKI under Scotland
Regards
Anna Smart
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X-Message: #13
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 15:23:44 +0100
From: Mike Lillington <>
To:
Message-ID: <zTqiwKAwV8K0Ewe$@rallymap.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: WHERE IS DUNTS HILL, WANDSWORTH
In article <60f4hd$>, Barbara Hopper
<> writes
>
>
>
> Recently learned that my HAYCROFT ancestors lived at
>Dunts Hill in Wandsworth in the 1830s.
>
Barbara,
Duntshill is located between the Earlsfield and Garratt areas south of
the general area of Wandsworth in the vicinity of Wandsworth Common.
I have an inexpensive map of Wandsworth Common dated 1893 in my emporium
showing Duntshill as it was then. Earlier, c1830 there would have been
very little in this area adjacent to the River Wandle.
The map is number 0648 in my Victorian and Edwardian Town Maps section,
it has a contemporary street directory extract and a potted history of
the area on the reverse. See www.rallymap.demon.co.uk/ for more details
or e-mail me.
--
Mike Lillington (The Ordnance Survey Mapping Specialist)
RALLYMAPS of WEST WELLOW, PO BOX 11, ROMSEY, HAMPSHIRE, SO51 8XX. U.K.
Tel/FAX: 01794 515444 International +44 1794 515444
www.rallymap.demon.co.uk e-mail:
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X-Message: #14
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 17:17:23 +0100
From: Barney Tyrwhitt-Drake <>
To:
Message-ID: <I35A6CATA+>
Subject: Re: Need Help
In article <>,
writes
>I am interested in tracing the family roots of Richard Mather 1596-1669, born
>Lancashire, England He was paster of the Congregational Church in Dorchester.
>He left England in 1635 for America. I am interested in finding info on his
>ancesters.
A good starting point would be the book "My ancestors were
Congregationalists" by David Clifford. The original 1992 edition has
very recently been revised and includes details of the whereabouts of
all known registers and lists of chapels for which the registers remain
unknown. You can buy it from the Society of Genealogists Bookshop for
3.90 UKP plus post and package. They accept Visa and Mastercard.
The MATHER family didn't all move to the US. There were other members of
the church with that surname who were writing on Congregationalism
issues in England late in the 17th and in the early 18th centuries.
--
Barney Tyrwhitt-Drake
Drake Software web site at http://www.tdrake.demon.co.uk/
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X-Message: #15
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 14:03:45 -0300
From: m12 <>
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Micklethwaite
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Am interested in researching my family name. if anyone has info wouls
appreciate an e-mail
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X-Message: #16
Date: 26 Sep 97 20:40:08 GMT
From: "David Nutt" <>
To:
Message-ID: <01bccabc$3bf7f6e0$>
Subject: Re: Occupation : Hind. ?
HIND - farm laborer
A good list of terms for old occupations can be found at
http://cpcug.org/user/jlacombe/terms.html
--
David Nutt
To reply via e-mail, remove the 'no.spam.' from the address
Ed Barron <> wrote in article
<>...
> Paul Radford <> wrote:
>
> >I have recently obtained the marriage certificate for some relatives
from 1853.
> >The brides' farther has the occupation of: Hind.
> >
> >Has anyone any suggestions what this might mean?
> >
> >The full stop after the word might indicate it is an abbreviation.
> >I know from the 1841 census that he was a farmer in Reeth, N.
Yorkshire.
> >By 1853 they had moved to Toft Hill, a mining community in S. Durham.
> >
> >Any suggestions gratefuly received.
> >
> >Thanks in advance.
> >
> >
> >Paul Radford
> >
> >Researching: Anderson / Herdman / Wearmouth (Co. Durham)
> > Burnett / Robinson (Scotland)
> > Flynn / O'Reilly (Birkenhead, Bristol & Wexford)
> > Golding (Norkolk)
> > Radford (Liverpool & Cardiff
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------------------------------
X-Message: #17
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 16:06:09 GMT
From: john[no_spam]@[no_spam]vetchfield.win-uk.net (John E Wynn)
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Re: King James the 1st of Scotland
In article <60ejb7$rpv$1@roch.zetnet.co.uk>,
() writes:
>In message <>
> (MRS CAROL ALBRECHT) writes:
>
>> Can anyone tell me who the children of King James the 1st of Scotland
>> are? Does anyone reconize the name of Ninian Stewart? Thank you...
>> Carol
>
>I do recognise the name Ninian Stewart. One of that name was a
>customs officer and lived in Grobsness, Delting parish, Shetland. He
>married 19 April 1831 Elizabeth Scott Adie from Voe. They had one son
>Robert born 12 December 1832. She married secondly Robert Mackay.
>
>No-one has ever been able to find out who this Ninian was.
>
>I did notice, in the magazine of the Scottish National Trust a couple
>of years ago, that the Queen, I think it was, had visited one of
>their properties and was entertained by Ninian Stewart who was
>descended from the owners, or still lived in, the house. I forget
>whether or not he had a title, I'm afraid.
>
>St Ninian was an important Scottish saint, so there may be several
>families using the forename without being related.
The voter lists show there are 186 people with the Ninian forename - and three
of them have the Stewart surname. They live in Glasgow, Southampton & Isle of
Arran.
John Wynn
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X-Message: #18
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 20:33:54 GMT
From:
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Re: Phone book lookup Banchory
I had a look on my phone disk cdrom and came up with the following:
Davidson and Garden
7 King Street
Denburn
Aberdeen
01224 626300
Hope it helps!
Regards,
Mik.
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X-Message: #19
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 19:08:39 GMT
From: (Rene Dussome)
To:
Message-ID: <60h1b6$>
Subject: Re: IGI: Squire Squire, and similar
Dave Beames <> wrote:
>This has probably been asked before, but if so, I missed it.
>Does anyone know why the IGI occasionally comes up with names like Squire
>Squire, and Major Major ?
Hi Dave:
You will notice an undersore in between names like Squire_Squire and
Major_Major. The name is repeated to confirm that it is a given name
and not a title.
Rene Dussome (Mrs)
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X-Message: #20
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 14:11:49 +0100
From: Chris Caley <>
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Re: Help in Croydon
In article <01bcca0b$54822e80$>, Lawrence Blake
<> writes
>Am looking for a company called Gillett and Johnston who made castings in
>Croydon in early 1900s. Have tried the yellow pages on the web and there is
>a company of the same name who make watches. I am assuming they are not the
>same, as castings of church bells and watches are not similar industries.
>
>Does anyone know what happened to the Gillett and Johnston who made
>castings and is there a contact with some knowledge of the company's
>history? Any help will be very much appreciated.
>
Lary
Many years ago I wrote an aricle for the Foundry Trade Journal (1963)
and their address is now listed as Queensway House, Queensway, Redhill,
Surrey. I was also invited to join The Institute of British Foundrymen
- their address then was 14 Pall Mall, London, SW1 but it is not now
listed in the London 'phone books
My thought was to suggest you contact either of these who may be able to
give you an address for Gillett and Johnson (if they still exist). Their
name rings little bells with me :-) Either of them may be able to give
some history of the firm. For my article I had some photographs taken in
Southern Foundries Ltd at Croydon. It's now defunk and part of a
shopping complex:-). There are very few foundries left now in the London
area.
Some one on the net may be able to give you better info on addresses
etc.
Best
-----
Chris Caley
When leaving this room, do not adjust your mind,
There may also be a fault in reality
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X-Message: #21
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 21:07:14 GMT
From: (Forrest Anderson)
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Re: Military insignia
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On Thu, 25 Sep 1997 15:20:27 +0100, "Glennis A. Whyte"
<> wrote:
>Sorry if this is a FAQ. Is there a web-site which holds pictures of
>military (UK army) insignia? Only clue to my gt.grandfather is a
>photo of him in uniform c. 1914-18 war - but don't know which
>regiment his badge relates to. Thanks.
As far as I know, there isn't a web-site that shows old badges. Some
sites show the *current* badge of the regiment, and in some cases the
modern badge is very similar a WW1 badge. Some interesting military
places to visit are:
The British Army Home page at: http://www.army.mod.uk/
T F Mills' British Army pages at:
http://www.du.edu/~tomills/military/bargt95.htm
Cyndi's List of Genealogy Sites on the Internet - Military Resources
Worldwide: http://www.oz.net/~cyndihow/milres.htm
On the other hand, with a bit of luck, I should be able to identify the
badge for you. Perhaps you can scan the photo and e-mail it to me, or
put it on your web-page.... Feel free to contact me for further
details.
Forrest
--
Forrest Anderson
Edinburgh
Scotland
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X-Message: #22
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 21:07:04 GMT
From: (Forrest Anderson)
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Re: Lucton public school, Herefordshire - any information anyone?
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
wrote
>I'm told that my grandfather, Isaac Gee Hadfield, attended Lucton
>School for a time but know nothing more about it. As he was born in
>1876 I assume he was there sometime during the 1880s. If anyone can
>give me any pointers as to where to look for more information I'd be
>very grateful.
On Fri, 26 Sep 1997 09:07:21 +0100, Barney Tyrwhitt-Drake
<> wrote:
>My great grandfather was a pupil there from 1865 to 1868. He was born in
>1853 in Ireland, which suggests that it was a boys boarding Public
>School. It was then sited at Leominster in Herefordshire. I have not yet
>looked for a school register, but someone in Hereford and Worcester
>Record Office may be able to tell you what records survive or even if
>the school is still going.
In the 1996 edition of "Independent Schools of the United Kingdom", the
address of the school was as follows:
Lucton School,
Near Leominster
Hereford and Worcester
HR6 9PN
Tel: 01568 780686
Forrest
--
Forrest Anderson
Edinburgh
Scotland
______________________________
------------------------------
X-Message: #23
Date: 26 Sep 1997 14:23:54 -0700
From:
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Pigot's Commercial Directory for Kent, 1839
First I want to thank all of you for your help, advice, etc. By someone
knowing someone who knows another I have made connections with my Foreman
relatives in England.
Now my question is (pleading ignorant) what is the Pigot's Commercial
Directory for Kent, 1839? My Foreman relative states that Felix Foreman I
(died in Lewisham about Feb 1860) was a storekeeper in Woolwich - very likely
Woolwich Arsenal which was a military depot just down the Thames from London.
Would the Directory show details?
Thank you.
______________________________
------------------------------
X-Message: #24
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 08:27:14 +0100
From: Stuart Cresswell <>
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Re: Christmas Day : 7th January
In message <ER8jjHAENoK0EwY+@tdrake.demon.co.uk>
Barney Tyrwhitt-Drake <> writes:
> Pope Gregory XIII defined a new calendar in which these 10 days
> would be made up by having a one-off correction of a year that was 10
> days short, and he decided that leap years would take place every 4
> years unless the year was exactly divisible by 400. This means that in
> the Gregorian Calendar the years 1600, 2000 and 2400 are *not* leap
> years.
Barney are you sure?
I think the correct system is there is a leap year every year that is
divisble by 4 unless it is also divisible by 100 and not by 400.
(There is also more fine tuning but that is beyond out life span).
That means that Julian leap years that are not Gregorian leap years
are (or were) 1700, 1800, 1900, 2100, 2200, 2300, 2500, etc. (2000
and 2400 are leap years)
Stuart
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------------------------------
X-Message: #25
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 08:30:04 +0100
From: Stuart Cresswell <>
To:
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Re: King James the 1st of Scotland
In message <60ejb7$rpv$1@roch.zetnet.co.uk>
writes:
> PS The only Scottish racing driver that I have heard of called
> Stewart was Jackie Stewart who has recently returned as a team
> manager. Was there another called Ninian Stewart?
> --
> Alan Beattie
Alan
Ninian was before Jackie (and not quite so succesful) He was also a
racing yachtsman.
Maybe you are not as ancient as I am?
Stuart
This thread: