GENEALOGY-DNA-L Archives

Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2003-07 > 1057145080


From: Ted Kandell <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] Y DNA results--Haplogroup G
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 04:24:40 -0700 (PDT)


Here is a table I have compiled for
Haplogroup G (which also overlaps with EU11):
(Populations with 0% have no figure in either column. Jewish groups begin with J-)

G/EU11 G2/1Ha

Georgian 30.1

Druze 19

J-North African 18

Sardinian 14.2

Central- northern Italian 10.0

Calabrian 8.0

Catalan 8.3

Turkish 6.6

J-Near Eastern 6

J-Kurdish 6

J-Roman 5

Saudi Arabians 5

Czech and Slovakian 4.4

Ukrainian 4.0

Lebanese 3.2

Palestinians 3

Syrian 3

Greek 2.6

Hungarian 2.2

J-Ashkenazi 2

Albanian 2.0

Croatian 1.7

Ethiopians 1.1

J-Yemenite

J-Ethiopian

Lemba

Andalusian

Spanish Basque

French Basque

French

Dutch

German

Macedonian

Polish

Egyptians

Tunisians

Sub-Saharan Africans

Saami

Udmurt

Mari



I think this is a very unusual distribution. I perhaps could explain this as follows:

Non-Jewish distribution:

The "center" of the distribution would be in the Caucasus (Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan). It is generally found throughout the Middle East, but has an unusually high concentration among the Druze of Israel, Lebanon, and Syria. It is notably absent from all North African populations, including Tunisians, a significant fact as we will see in a moment. There is a decreasing concentration among Balkan populations, and a relatively high concentration among Italians, esp. North Central Italians. The only Iberians who have it are the Catalans. There are also small percentages in Hungary, among Czechs and Slovaks and among Ukrainians. No other groups posess this haplotype in any significan numbers.

Among the Jews, almost all Jewish groups are represented except the Yemenite Jews, The Yemenites, according to other data such as a lack of mtDNA haplogroup H, have gone through a severe genetic bottleneck at some point in the past, making them somewhat genetically distinctive among Jewish populations. This haplogroup is heavily represented among North African Jews, but totally absent from North African non-Jewish populations. The same is true for several "neighboring" populations of Jewish groups that have Haplogroup G, for example it is totally absent among the Germans and the Poles, while present among the Ashkenazi Jews, who lived for centuries among these groups.

I would guess the following: That the Hungarian, Czech, Slovak and Ukrainian representatives of Haplogroup G are either Jews (this is from two separate studies, one of which didnt differentiate Jewish and non-Jewish populations) or of Jewish descent. This would explain why the haplogroup is not found at all among neighboring related populations, such as the Poles and the Germans (who colonized Hungary and Poland in the Middle Ages). The Catalans could have either derived their Haplogroup G from the large Jewish populations that lived in Iberia in the Middle Ages and later assimilated, or from Roman colonists from Italy, since this is the part of Spain that was ruled longest by the Romans. Roman influence however, still cannot explain why the French, who have some Gallo-Roman background, are lacking in Haplogroup G.



The high percentage in Sardinia may signal perhaps Phonecian ancestry, especially since this is present among the Lebanese who are the current residents of ancient Phonecia. However,one would expect the Tunisians, the descendants of the Carthaginians, who were in turn Phonecian colonists, to have Haplogroup G, and they don't. Also, I don't belive that Sardinia ever had a large Jewish population either.

The presence of Haplogroup G among the Italians, could be due to several factors: Neolithic input from Asia Minor, and even historic migrations, assuming the Etruscans had an element of immigrants from Asia Minor and the Caucasus, as some ancient authors such as Herodotus claimed.Perhaps also Greek and Balkan colonists in Italy provided an input in areas that the Etruscans never settled, such as Calabria (the ancient Messapians of Calabria were said to speak an Illyrian Balkan language.)

Another possibility is that large numbers of Jews were deported to Italy as slaves after the two Jewish revolts in 70 and 135 CE and this increased the percentage among the Italians as well. That could also explain why Italy has a higher percentage than the Balkans, which is nearer to the "center".

The Near East shows a pretty smooth gradient going from north to south, with the exception of the Druze. The Druze are a closed society since the 11th century, and may represent an earlier non-Jewish population of northern Palestine and Lebanon. It is also known that certain Druze clans were of "Yemeni Arab" origin (as were many clans of the Palestinians), and other clans were of "Kurdish" origin (e.g. Jumblatt), perhaps coming from the North, closer to the Caucasus.

I would generally say, that Haplogroup G is of Northern Near Eastern origin, perhaps spread to Italy by the Etruscans (if any of them came from Asia Minor) and south through the Near East by anciant Caucasian peoples such as the Hurrians, who were found all over the Near East, even in ancient Palestine/Canaan. but who never settled in Egypt.

One other interesting piece of data: In my own FTDNA results, everyone out to 4 mutations out of 25 (in Haplogroup G) are Ashkenazi Jews. This would give an MRCA of at least 2000 years, and so would probably preclude more recent neighbors of the Ashkenazi Jews such as the Germans and Poles as "contributors" (and indeed, they are lacking in Haplogroup G).It maybe be possible it derives from the Romans, but that wouldn't explain the presence in higher percentages among Jewish groups such as Kurdish and Iraq/Iranian Jews (Near Eastern Jews) that probably never lived under Roman domination.I would guess that the presence of this Haplogroup among Jews is a signal of "Near Eastern origin" in much the same way as the CMH (Cohen Modal Haplotype, Haplogroup J) is. Interestingly, CMH is also found among the SAME groups as well, such as Northern Italians, Hungarians, Palestinians, and it is the second most common haplotype among the Armenians outside of Jewish populations. The MRCA for!
CMH is
around 1000 BCE or so.

Why would the same disparate groups have both Haplogroup G and the CMH subtype of Haplogroup J?

Any ideas?

Ted Kandell





---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!


This thread: