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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2005-03 > 1111339220


From: "AAF" <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] Variations of R1b Ydna in Europe: Distribution and Origins
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 18:11:47 -0000


PS: to my previous posting.
A quick look at the YHRD's 20 commonest haplotypes for Finland shows:
(i) that 22.55% of the WHOLE Finnish population is completely modal at with
DGarvey's N3 guideline. One can infer from this that the percentage of N3
haplotypes as a percentage of the N3 population is even greater.
(ii) Not one of the commonest 20 haplotypes has a 13 at DYS392 !!
Alan Foster.
========

----- Original Message -----
From: "AAF" <>
To: <>
Sent: Sunday, March 20, 2005 3:29 PM
Subject: Re: [DNA] Variations of R1b Ydna in Europe: Distribution and
Origins


> John,
> Aren't you being a little picky?. By scanning only the modal values that i
> did in the way that i did, i deliberately increased the possibilities to
> provide a more rigorous test. I could have argued as follows:
> (i) D Garvey lists these modals for N3:
> DYS19=14;
> DYS389i/ii= 14,30;
> DYS390=24;
> DYS391=11;
> DYS392=14;
> DYS393=14;
> DYS385a/b=11,13
> If i enter this lot into the YHRD, but change DYS392 to a value of 13, I
get
> only two results for the whole of Europe: one in London and one in Italy.
> (ii) If I then speculate that 95% of N3 are non modal over the six other
> markers of DGarvey's guideline, then I am still only left with the
> probability of 40 cases, IN THE WHOLE OF EUROPE, which could sneak into
> somebody's R1b survey using a filter of DYS392=13.
>
> Alan Foster.
> ================
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Chandler" <>
> Sent: Sunday, March 20, 2005 3:51 AM
>
>
> > Alan wrote:
> > > As promised, yesterday, here is my data on whether some of my
DYS392=13
> data
> > > could have been "leakage/mutations" of N3 which has a modal of
> DYS392=14,
> > > and which is especially prevalent Finland and the eastern Baltic. My
> data
> > > shows that a maximum of three N3 haplotypes (1.9% of the total) might
> have
> > > slipped in to my survey sample of 159 haplotypes taken from the
> > > Russian-Baltic area.
> >
> > I disagree. It seems to me that you have showed merely that perhaps 3
> > *classic* N3 haplotypes slipped into your survey. What you did was
> > scan the database for haplotypes that were exactly modal on at least 3
> > markers. If you go back and reassess your scan in a different light,
> > you get a very different conclusion. You found 38 haplotypes with
> > 393=14,389i=14,389ii=30,392=13 in all of Europe. etc..........
>


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