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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2005-04 > 1114267124


From: "Garland Boyette" <>
Subject: RE: [DNA] Haplogroup E3a SNP P1+
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 14:38:44 +0000


I continue to be shocked that people are shocked by the discovery of
membership in haplogroups atypical for their regions of origin (E3a among
Europeans tends to create a great deal of shock, C3, and O2 a bit less so).
Haplogroups are tens of thousands of years old, periods of time that predate
our modern notions of race and ethnicity. All Y-DNA haplogroups have
members that belong to all races. Here's a link to a study to a study
comparing haplogroup frequency between groups of Caucasian and
African-American men:

www.bioforensics.com/conference04/ Racial_Identification/Y-SNP.pdf

And though this particular study didn't find any E3a among the Caucasian
men, a good number of studies that I've seen of Europeans do find
occasionally find E3a. And the second most common haplogroup among
African-American men in the above study.....you guessed it, R1b. There have
been flows and migrations among the continents for millennia, so in my
opinion, none of this should really come as a shock. Not only in this
country, where people of European, African, Native American, and Asian
origins have been living together for hundreds of years. And though I'm no
expert in the area, we should shouldn't forget that the Atlantic slave trade
brought almost as many Africans to Europe as to North America. The figures
that I recall having seen indicate that approx. 6 million Africans were
enslaved during the period, 4 million of whom went to Latin America and the
Caribbean, half a million to North America, and half a million to Europe,
the difference being that the numbers brought to the Americas constituted a
greater portion of the overall population. It has to be assumed that many
of this people were ultimately absorbed into the indigenous European
populations.

Here's an additional link to a family surname project many of whose European
origin members are E3a:

www.ivey-ivie-ivy.org/dna

It's all pretty interesting!

Garland
Adminstrator, Boyett(e) Surname DNA Project
http://www.familytreedna.com/public/boyette/
http://bellsouthpwp.net/B/o/Boyt-Boyett/Page.htm



>From: WalMax <>
>Reply-To:
>To:
>Subject: [DNA] Haplogroup E3a SNP P1+
>Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 07:39:36 -0400
>
>Terry,
>
>I was tested in the Fall of 2003 and was shocked to find I was E3a and that
>meant I was of African descent. It was beyond belief.
>
>My ancestor Christian Gabinish was born 1820 in Lothringa, Alsace Lorraine.
>He came to Cincinnati, Ohio from there in 1848/49. They were bilingual but
>spoke primarily French. There is no chance that my ancestry is a result of
>anything that happened in Colonial America or the Slave situation in the
>South. They were very typical of that area of Europe and were devout
>Catholics. Their profession was to make clothing, they were tailors and
>bakers.
>
>Sometime between their arrival here and the death of Christian in 1890 they
>changed their name to its present spelling Gabennesch. According to
>information, from what I consider reliable sources, it seems, much to my
>amazement, that the name evolved from the Italian Gabinius to the German
>Gabinish/Gabinisch. One of the reliable sources being Theodor Mommsen the
>German Pulitzer Prize winning historian of the 19th Century for authoring
>"The Roman Empire".
>
>So how did my "African Ancestor" get to Europe to adopt an Italian name and
>make the evolution or transition from a dark skinned African to a white
>skinned Caucasian? How could he have traveled from the west coast of Africa
>to Italy and the Lower Rhine River Valley?
>
>There is nothing I have found that would explain how a Sub Saharan African
>Bantu who is suppose to have migrated to the west coast of African 1100 to
>3000 years ago could have made that trip and the transition. My "African
>Ancestor" had to have been in Europe for a very, very long time not just a
>few hundred of years. Did he go there as a slave? Did he go there as a
>soldier?
>
>I think there is a lot to be learned, but these are such isolated instances
>no one has that interest. I am hoping that the Genographic program will
>turn up some more E3a's in Central Europe and even perhaps in Italy.
>Needless to say I am frustrated. On the other hand, I enjoy being in the
>somewhat unique position of being a Caucasian with an African Haplogroup.
>
>Locus-----------------DYS#----------------Alleles
> 1 393 13
> 2 390 21
> 3 19 15
> 4 391 11
> 5 385a 16
> 6 385b 17
> 7 426 11
> 8 388 12
> 9 439 12
> 10 389-1 13
> 11 392 11
> 12 389-2 32
>
>Walt,
>
>
>
>==============================
>View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find
>marriage announcements and more. Learn more:
>http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx
>

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