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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2005-04 > 1114282758


From: "Lowe DNA" <>
Subject: RE: [DNA] Haplogroup E3a SNP P1+
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 13:59:41 -0500
In-Reply-To: <01b601c54835$20b18aa0$1002a8c0@Sharon>


Sharon...

Ask them for a SNP test...that is the only way
to definitely know whether I or O...

Bill

-----Original Message-----
From: Sharon Bryant [mailto:]
Sent: Saturday, April 23, 2005 11:55 AM
To:
Subject: Re: [DNA] Haplogroup E3a SNP P1+


Garland,

I recently had a project member who received an estimate of O2. When I ran
it through Whit's predictor it came closer to I than O. When I questioned
FTDNA about it, Bennett acknowledged that it could be one of the more exotic
variants of I. They have sense changed the haplogroup estimate on the
participants personal page (at GAP) to an I.

Just a thought to keep in mind.

Sharon
----- Original Message -----
From: "Garland Boyette" <>
To: <>
Sent: Saturday, April 23, 2005 10:38 AM
Subject: RE: [DNA] Haplogroup E3a SNP P1+


>I continue to be shocked that people are shocked by the discovery of
>membership in haplogroups atypical for their regions of origin (E3a among
>Europeans tends to create a great deal of shock, C3, and O2 a bit less so).
>Haplogroups are tens of thousands of years old, periods of time that
>predate our modern notions of race and ethnicity. All Y-DNA haplogroups
>have members that belong to all races. Here's a link to a study to a study
>comparing haplogroup frequency between groups of Caucasian and
>African-American men:
>
> www.bioforensics.com/conference04/ Racial_Identification/Y-SNP.pdf
>
> And though this particular study didn't find any E3a among the Caucasian
> men, a good number of studies that I've seen of Europeans do find
> occasionally find E3a. And the second most common haplogroup among
> African-American men in the above study.....you guessed it, R1b. There
> have been flows and migrations among the continents for millennia, so in
> my opinion, none of this should really come as a shock. Not only in this
> country, where people of European, African, Native American, and Asian
> origins have been living together for hundreds of years. And though I'm
> no expert in the area, we should shouldn't forget that the Atlantic slave
> trade brought almost as many Africans to Europe as to North America. The
> figures that I recall having seen indicate that approx. 6 million Africans
> were enslaved during the period, 4 million of whom went to Latin America
> and the Caribbean, half a million to North America, and half a million to
> Europe, the difference being that the numbers brought to the Americas
> constituted a greater portion of the overall population. It has to be
> assumed that many of this people were ultimately absorbed into the
> indigenous European populations.
>
> Here's an additional link to a family surname project many of whose
> European origin members are E3a:
>
> www.ivey-ivie-ivy.org/dna
>
> It's all pretty interesting!
>
> Garland
> Adminstrator, Boyett(e) Surname DNA Project
> http://www.familytreedna.com/public/boyette/
> http://bellsouthpwp.net/B/o/Boyt-Boyett/Page.htm
>
>
>
>>From: WalMax <>
>>Reply-To:
>>To:
>>Subject: [DNA] Haplogroup E3a SNP P1+
>>Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 07:39:36 -0400
>>
>>Terry,
>>
>>I was tested in the Fall of 2003 and was shocked to find I was E3a and
>>that meant I was of African descent. It was beyond belief.
>>
>>My ancestor Christian Gabinish was born 1820 in Lothringa, Alsace
>>Lorraine. He came to Cincinnati, Ohio from there in 1848/49. They were
>>bilingual but spoke primarily French. There is no chance that my ancestry
>>is a result of anything that happened in Colonial America or the Slave
>>situation in the South. They were very typical of that area of Europe and
>>were devout Catholics. Their profession was to make clothing, they were
>>tailors and bakers.
>>
>>Sometime between their arrival here and the death of Christian in 1890
>>they changed their name to its present spelling Gabennesch. According to
>>information, from what I consider reliable sources, it seems, much to my
>>amazement, that the name evolved from the Italian Gabinius to the German
>>Gabinish/Gabinisch. One of the reliable sources being Theodor Mommsen the
>>German Pulitzer Prize winning historian of the 19th Century for authoring
>>"The Roman Empire".
>>
>>So how did my "African Ancestor" get to Europe to adopt an Italian name
>>and make the evolution or transition from a dark skinned African to a
>>white skinned Caucasian? How could he have traveled from the west coast of
>>Africa to Italy and the Lower Rhine River Valley?
>>
>>There is nothing I have found that would explain how a Sub Saharan African
>>Bantu who is suppose to have migrated to the west coast of African 1100 to
>>3000 years ago could have made that trip and the transition. My "African
>>Ancestor" had to have been in Europe for a very, very long time not just a
>>few hundred of years. Did he go there as a slave? Did he go there as a
>>soldier?
>>
>>I think there is a lot to be learned, but these are such isolated
>>instances no one has that interest. I am hoping that the Genographic
>>program will turn up some more E3a's in Central Europe and even perhaps in
>>Italy. Needless to say I am frustrated. On the other hand, I enjoy being
>>in the somewhat unique position of being a Caucasian with an African
>>Haplogroup.
>>
>>Locus-----------------DYS#----------------Alleles
>> 1 393 13
>> 2 390 21
>> 3 19 15
>> 4 391 11
>> 5 385a 16
>> 6 385b 17
>> 7 426 11
>> 8 388 12
>> 9 439 12
>> 10 389-1 13
>> 11 392 11
>> 12 389-2 32
>>
>>Walt,
>>
>>
>>
>>==============================
>>View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find
>>marriage announcements and more. Learn more:
>>http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx
>>
>
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>
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>
>



==============================
Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the
last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more:
http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx





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