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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2005-06 > 1118454053


From: ellen Levy <>
Subject: Re: Re: [DNA] Question - Haplogroup R1A1
Date: Fri, 10 Jun 2005 18:40:53 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <20050611002343.GTAW19494.fed1rmmtao06.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net>


Jim:

Your Levite matches are based on the fact that over
50% of this group is R1a1.

This haplogroup is not "Nordic," but as David noted,
can be used to trace Viking ancestry for those in the
British Isles. Furthermore, R1a1 is fairly prevelant
in Scandinavian groups (25% overall, is that correct,
David??)

Haplogroup R1a1 did not originate in Scandinavia and
the migration of this haplogroup to Norway & Sweden is
a matter of great debate, as David Faux can attest to.
In fact, the origins of this haplogroup remain a
mystery and continue to be greatly debated. I fall
into the camp that believes this haplogroup developed
in areas between the Black and Caspian Seas - right
around where the Kurgan culture occurred about 6000
BC, but as David Wilson noted, this haplogroup is far
older than this archaeologically-defined cultural
entity. It is probably also closely connected to the
Indo-Iranian (Bactria) cultures that occurred somewhat
further east. This moves us closer to the region
where others like David Faux believe R1a1 originated -
in the areas around Pakistan and Afghanistan.

A few months back, we discussed on the List where the
precusor to R1a1 - haplogroup R1a - has been found.
As far as I know, it has only been located in some
Turkish populations, which moves us back to the Black
& Caspian Sea region again, though in a more southern
location.

Ellen Coffman

--- wrote:

> David,
>
> Thanks for the reply. We did have the whole 37
> marker test done through FTDNA.
> You wrote -YCAIIa,b = 19,21 and our are YCAIIa,b =
> 19,23
> also in the haplogroup matches we had a lot of
> Ashkenazi Levite matches?
> Once again thank for the reply.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Jim Carpenter
>
> >
> > From: (David Faux)
> > Date: 2005/06/10 Fri PM 08:05:14 EDT
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: [DNA] Question - Haplogroup R1A1
> >
> > Jim:
> >
> > If your ancestors are from Britain, then R1a1 is
> almost certainly the stamp of Vikings circa 793 AD
> on. There is an unmistakable indicator found in 40%
> of R1a1 Norwegians and in all of my Shetland sample
> who have aboriginal surnames - YCAIIa,b = 19,21. If
> you have that pattern (you need to have FTDNA's full
> 37 markers since it is in the third panel - or be
> tested by another company who also measures it) then
> you are of Norse origin. The motif 19,23 is
> universal in Eastern Europe and in 60% of
> Norwegians, but the 19, 21 with R1a1 is clearly
> Viking and has not been observed in any Eastern
> European sample to date. If your ancestor is from
> Poland or Germany, however, then FTDNA's explanation
> would be approximately correct.
> >
> > David F.
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------- Original message --------------
> >
> > > This is my first post here on the list and let
> me start with this. I am by no
> > > way a DNA expert so if I seem a little confused
> well ----- I am.
> > > We did our yDNA testing through FTDNA and when
> we got the results back we had
> > > several matches which helped somewhat but I'm
> still stuck at my brick wall.
> > > That's another story.
> > > My question is this --for the Haplogroup matches
> it shows it to be R1A1 for my
> > > brother.
> > > I have researched this Haplogroup but I find
> myself running in circles. One site
> > > says this group is Nordic. FTDNA says
> > >
> > > R1a The R1a lineage is believed to have
> originated in the Eurasian Steppes
> > > north of the Black and Caspian Seas. This
> lineage is believed to have originated
> > > in a population of the Kurgan culture, known for
> the domestication of the horse
> > > (approximately 3000 B.C.E.). These people were
> also believed to be the first
> > > speakers of the Indo-European language group.
> This lineage is currently found in
> > > central and western Asia, India, and in Slavic
> populations of Eastern Europe.
> > >
> > > So in finding this is it safe to say that
> Haplogroup R1A1 is found in both
> > > locations?
> > > Could someone please explain this to me?
> > >
> > > Thanks!
> > >
> > > Best Regards,
> > >
> > > Jim Carpenter
> >
> >
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