GENEALOGY-DNA-L ArchivesArchiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2005-06 > 1119828862
From: "Dale E. Reddick" <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] R1b1c
Date: Sun, 26 Jun 2005 19:36:48 -0400
On a wholly non-DNA front, I thought that it was cruel for you to tell
all of us (back on June 11) that you were heading off to Tuscany for a
And now, you are so terrible as to tell us that you're residing in an
18th century Tuscan villa. You should be so, soooo... ...ashamed! ;-)
Keep on having a nice vacation. At least you missed all of the
earth-shaking excitement out there on the left coast! :-\
David Faux wrote:
>When checking my e-mail from an 18th Century villa looking out over beautiful Lake Maggiore in Italy I received word that our lab had confirmed that I am M269-R1b1c.
>While this is not a particularly surprizing finding, actually fully expected, I was very pleased to see in front of me the evidence providing the ultimate proof that my ancestors were descendants of "the patriarch" of over 50% of the population of Western Europe, North America, Australia and so on. In my opinion, as David Wilson has noted, the commonly employed SNPs M343 and P25 are too far up the chain and those identified with those monikers will never know for sure that they are truly M269 (now being used in most of the recent landmark studies such as Cinnioglu 2004). I also have 43 STRs and ultimately will obtain p49a,f Taq and MSY1 minisatellite data to round out everything that can be unearthed about the Y chromosome I happen to possess.
>Earlier the lab had confirmed that I did not have any of the R1b1 subclade SNPs that have to date been identified, and which largely seem to have emerged in Iberia in relatively recent times. It will take further testing of other European regions to confirm the regionality of these SNPs. Two SNPs could not be tested since the author has chosen not to release the sequences that would enable us to construct primers, and one (M222) was omitted since it has been associated with infertility. At present we are doing research and development work on a newly discovered (by one of our very clever Listers) R1b SNP to ascertain whether it has regional associations or is a private SNP.
>I am hoping that this encourages all of us with R1b "credentials" to realize that there is much that can be learned (even negative evidence is worthwhile) about our deep ancestry, and that there is much more coming down the pike.
>My dream is to eventually find markers compliment and expand on motifs such as the 25/11/14 pattern described for Ireland by David Wilson. I would be very surprised if eventually we did not locate, for example, some Y markers that serve to characterize Pictish descendants. I know that I am an optomist, but I do try to have my finger on the pulse of what future developments. There was a time when a similar situation prevailed with mtDNA haplogroup H. Now various authors have found identifyable subclades; and for example we have located one that appears to occur only in the Northern Isles and the Scottish Highlands (more on this later).
>I guess we all have to be patient, and it does not help that funding for pop gen studies is drying up in favor of medical genome screening studies, but we are finding ways around even these problems (using "piggyback research"). The future looks very bright and when we have our first M269 from a firmly dated 30000 year old archaeological site I will not be in the least surprised, only relieved that we have broken another seemingly impossible barrier.
>Were the "mysterious" Etruscans largely R1b1c or J2 or something else; were they put to the sword by the Romans or did they emigrate to Corsica (for example) ............. time will tell.
>Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the
>last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx
|Re: [DNA] R1b1c by "Dale E. Reddick" <>|