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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2005-11 > 1131750408


From: "D. Wilson" <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] Haplotype Q and Autosomes
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 15:08:42 -0800
References: <20051111225812.62507.qmail@web50710.mail.yahoo.com>


David (and Doug too, who contacted me off list) --

Many thanks. I was obviously underinformed about Q in this hemisphere, and
now I'm not. Any day on which you learn something is a good day, and my day
just got better.

Jim, on this basis consider yourself restored to uncertainty.

Thanks again,

David W.


----- Original Message -----
From: "David Faux" <>
To: <>
Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 2:58 PM
Subject: Re: [DNA] Haplotype Q and Autosomes


> David and Jim:
>
> Native American Y chromosome include Q3 (M3, M19), Q (P36, M242), P
> (M45), and C (RPS4Y).
>
> Using Bortolini et al. (AJHG, 73:524-539, 2003) as an example, a total of
> 347 Amerinds from South America were genotyped as follows:
>
> Q3 = 83%; Q = 9%; P = 4% and C = 0%
>
> Looking at 48 Na Dene of North America, the following figures applied:
>
> Q3 = 6%; Q = 25%; P = 63%; and C = 6%
>
> Depending on location in North and South America Q without the M3
> derivation is actually quite common.
>
> David Faux.
>
> "D. Wilson" <> wrote:
> Jim,
>
> To the best of my knowledge the Native American Q population belongs
> entirely to subclade Q3. I suppose it is possible that some Q* people came
> across the land bridge to the New World at or near the same time the Q3
> population did, but I don't recall any studies of New World populations
> that
> found undifferentiated Q haplogroup individuals. If the studies exist but
> I
> have missed them, I hope someone will call them to my attention.
>
> What this means is that you, who SNP-tested positive for haplogroup Q but
> negative for subhaplogroup Q3, should probably look to the Q population of
> Northern Europe (and before that, North Central Asia) for your patrilineal
> ancestry.
>
> The feature your dentist described is known as the shovel-shaped incisor.
> It
> is found broadly among Native Americans and some Asian populations.
> According to a Google search I just ran, there are individuals with
> shovel-shaped incisors in Sweden. So tooth morphology by itself does not
> point unambiguously to Native American ancestry.
>
> I am sure you are right about autosomal genes controlling tooth shape. I
> would not expect to see such a gene on the Y-chromosome. The traits could
> be
> inherited from an autosomal chromosome carried by either parent. It
> wouldn't
> be on mtDNA, a specialized form of non-nuclear DNA whose genes are
> involved
> with metabolic processes and have nothing to do with body morphology
> (though
> a bad mtDNA mutation might lead to defective metabolism that could be
> associated with a physical manifestation.)
>
> So the analysis boils down to this: dental characteristics permit either
> Native American or North Eurasian ancestry. The SNP-determined haplogroup
> Q
> (rather than Q3) points strongly to North Eurasian patrilineal origins. I
> think that probably answers your question.
>
> David Wilson
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jim Lawson"
> To:
> Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 8:13 AM
> Subject: [DNA] Haplotype Q and Autosomes
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>> Hello list, I wonder if anyone could speak to this question. I am
>> Haplotype
>> Q, that is P36+ M3-, and we do not yet know if my line came through
>> Native
>> Americans or from a western migration from Asia toward Scandinavia. My
>> questions is this, my dentist told me that my teeth indicated Native
>> American ancestry but would that be also true for a Q haplotype that came
>> to
>> this country via the western route? I would assume that the shape of my
>> teeth would be determined by autosomes and not by the yDNA markers for
>> Haplotype Q and that these autosomes could come from either mtDNA or yDNA
>> Or
>> both.
>>
>> Fantastic list, Jim Lawson
>>
>>
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> ==============================
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