Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2006-01 > 1136833819

From: "James R Carr" <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] Assyrian Heritage DNA Project
Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2006 11:10:19 -0800
References: <BAY101-F7DEA60E662A0E1F163BF1B8220@phx.gbl>

Try the Surname Project Eli. If the FTDNA customer signed the waiver, their
data will be displayed there. FTDNA encouraged people to upload their
results to Y-Search but they can't compel them. It's frustrating. I'm sure I
match someone on the face of the earth, but they either haven't tested yet
or are to paranoid to share. The coordinator for our Carr group has
assembled a lot of data. But the trouble is convincing a lot of them to
share. Some are vehemently against it
----- Original Message -----
From: "Eli d S" <>
To: <>
Sent: Monday, January 09, 2006 10:30 AM
Subject: RE: [DNA] Assyrian Heritage DNA Project

> Just a comment on an aspect of FTDNA that I find troublesome. It is a
> private database, unless I have tested with them I don't have access to
> their records. The bigger their database becomes the worst off you will be
> precisely because it is a private database. Although there are some 50,000
> records in that database because I haven't paid for their overpriced tests
> I don't have access to them, and so, I find that although their customers
> and I could benefit from those records being on a public database that
> wont happen because while it is true their customers could upload their
> results to a public database they (FTDNA) know most wont, and clearly that
> is the case as less than half do.
> I stay away from FTDNA one because by comparison to say
> their products are twice as expensive or more, and most importantly their
> database storing your information becomes 'proprietary' of sorts, with no
> clear gains to you. Your goal is to be able to compare records with
> others, that wont happen unless they have paid the price of admission at
> FTDNA, I find it to be akin to the Windows situation, once they have
> enough clout everybody must use their services and they will free to
> charge as much as they want for instance MSWord is ten times more
> expensive than Openoffice because they have the market cornered.
> Eli
> From: "Ed & Mary Yonan" <>
> Reply-To:
> To:
> Subject: [DNA] Assyrian Heritage DNA Project
> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2006 01:31:25 -0800
> A few weeks ago another person and I started the Assyrian Heritage DNA
> project, which will be focused to a siginificant degree on these goals:
> * To help anyone of Assyrian descent, both male and female, gain a better
> understanding of his or her ethnic identity and heritage.
> * To help Assyrians learn the place of origin of their Assyrian ancestors.
> My husband has already received his 37 marker YDNA and high resolution mt
> DNA results and has received his SNP test results which place him in the
> R1a Y-Haplogroup (SRY 10831.2-) and in the J* mtDNA haplogroup. He
> matches no one else in the FTDNA database or Y-search on either his YDNA
> or mtDNA markers. My husband's Y-search ID is UKF7K.
> My husband's ancestors are NOT from Europe. He is Assyrian and his father
> and all generations before him, that we know about, lived in an Assyrian
> village in the Hakkari Mountains located in modern day Turkey. When my
> father-in-law migrated to the USA in 1909 that area was part of the
> Ottoman Empire. It was only after World War I that modern national
> boundaries were drawn in that region. At that time the Hakkari Mountains
> fell within the boundaries of modern day Turkey.
> We have ordered the R1a deep SNP test from FTDNA. It will be interesting
> to see what "twig" of the phylogenic tree the results will place him on.
> Naturally, I want to gain an understanding of ancient haplogroups and how
> they are relevant specifically to men and women who descend from the
> ancient Assyrians. There is a website that includes a map of ancient
> Assyria, a timeline of Assyrian history and other information.
> As the above website explains, the ancient Assyrian Empire may have had
> its beginnings as early as 2400 B.C. Most Assyrians lived in the same
> area of the Middle East, the region known as Mesopotamia or the Fertile
> Crescent, from 2400 B.C. until approximately 100 years ago, and some still
> live there. For this reason, we will be focusing much more on deep
> ancestry than on finding a modern-day cousin, although that may happen
> also.
> It will be very interesting to discover whether Assyrians fall into a few
> or several different haplogroups. Since the Assyrians conquered many
> different nations and were in turn conquered by other nations from 2400
> B.C. until the Assyrian Empire was defeated in 612 B.C., is it likely that
> modern-day Assyrians will belong to several Y and mtDNA haplogroups? On
> the other hand, the Assyrians were one of the earliest groups to convert
> to Christianity and have long been an ethnic and religious minority in the
> Middle East. They have historically been quite endogamous. Would that
> point toward the possibility that modern-day Assyrians will belong to a
> small number of Y and mtDNA haplogroups? Answering these questions is
> the goal of the Assyian Heritage DNA Project. However, I'd love to hear
> the comments of members of this list on what you predict that we may
> learn.
> I am hoping to get a variety of suggestions from the members of this list
> about the type of DNA testing we should recommend to men and women
> interested in participating in the Assyrian Heritage DNA project. Here
> are my questions:
> Which is a better approach for a project such as I have described....(1)
> advise participants to test only 12 Y-DNA markers and/or the
> low-resolution mtDNA markers and then do a SNP test to confirm the
> haplogroup or (2) advise participants to test all 37 Y-DNA markers and/or
> the high-resolution mtDNA markers?
> If you suggest that it would be adequate to test only 12 Y-DNA markers
> and/or the low-resolution mtDNA markers and then do a SNP test to confirm
> the haplogroup, should we recommend that participants order their test
> from National Geographic and then transfer their results to the FTDNA
> database? My only concern about this approach is that it's more
> complicated to announce the project and explain how participants can
> become members of the Assyrian Heritage DNA Project. It's definitely a
> more circuitous approach and important potential participants may never
> take the essential step of transferring their Genographic results from the
> Geno database at NGS to the private database at FTDNA. As you explained in
> another message: The transfer process from NG to FTDNA is free. Once in
> the FTDNA database, a participant
> would use the blue JOIN button in his/her new personal account page at
> FTDNA to join a DNA Project. It only takes a few mouse clicks to do that.
> Does anyone know if any FTDNA geographic or heritage project has used this
> approach?
> Thanks for your advise,
> Mary Allison Yonan
> ==============================
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