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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2006-04 > 1146319700


From: "Ken Nordtvedt" <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] R1b SNP page updated
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2006 08:08:20 -0600
References: <NFBBJIGLNLMGJIOLOGFBIEMMGLAA.scorpion@netconnect.com.au>


Because 9-9 is such a common minority motif at DYS459 for R1b (and that sure
needs an explanation), and this deviation from 9-10 is not confined to a
specific few sub-populations (varieties), there result in SMGF, for example,
over 500 haplotypes with DYS459 = 9-9. So just random, individual mutations
will generate the extra 40 or so DYS459 = 8-9 haplotypes seen in a large
database such as SMGF or Ysearch. The fact that there is no geographical
concentration or no other markers with decisive modal shifts from R1b as a
whole indicates there is most likely no "grouping" here. Not only is the
13-13-15-17 at DYS464 an important feature of the true Irish variety, but
also the DYS463 = 23 instead of 22 is important.

Do you find any "handle" to grab onto for your grouping other than the 456
and 439 information below? 456 = 15/16 is the norm for R1b as a whole, and
for 439 11 repeats is 45 percent of 12 repeats for the entire R1b
population.

Ken


----- Original Message -----
From: "Dennis Wright" <>
To: <>
Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2006 7:17 AM
Subject: RE: [DNA] R1b SNP page updated


> Hi Gareth,
>
> I have found another grouping which has the 459 = 8,9 but with the normal
> 464 alleles.
>
> This could be a halfway grouping from Atlantic to Irish Type III.
> Modal is Atlantic except
>
> 459 = 8,9
> 439 = 11/12
> 456 = 15/16
> I have 30 sets of results but those that have origins other than USA or
> Unknown, are from all over Europe and the British Isles so it could be
> earlier than the Irish Type II grouping.
>
> Cheers
> Dennis Wright
> Irish Type III
> 6PWCD waiting on R1b deep clade testing
>
>
>
>
>
>> Dennis
>>
>> It would also be interesting to see DYS464X results for someone in this
>> group - it looks like there may have been at least two unusual mutational
>> events (a multistep deletion and a recombination/conversion) to arrive at
>> the 13-13-15-17 pattern. I'm curious why this coincides with a
>> possible two
>> step deletion at DYS459.
>>
>> Gareth
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Dennis Wright" <>
>> To: <>
>> Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2006 12:47 PM
>> Subject: RE: [DNA] R1b SNP page updated
>>
>>
>> > John,
>> >
>> > Has anyone with the Irish Type III, 459 = 8,9 and 464 =
>> 13,13,15,17 been SNP
>> > tested yet?
>> > I am waiting for my SNP test, Batch 143, was due 19 Apr, now 17 May.
>> > Hopefully it will be M222- to differentiate from NW Irish but I
>> am intrigued
>> > to see if there is a +ve marker.
>> > I have results at 439, 441 and 463 so probably will be S26-,
>> S48- and S25-.
>> >
>> > Will advise when I have results.
>> > Cheers
>> >
>> > Dennis Wright
>> > Irish Type III
>> > 6PWCD waiting on R1b deep clade testing
>>
>>
>> ==============================
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> d=14599&targetid=5429
>
>
>
>
> ==============================
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>
>


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