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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2006-05 > 1147823271


From: "brian quinn" <>
Subject: RE: [DNA] Help Please - Irish Surnames
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 09:47:51 +1000
In-Reply-To: <3e2.2bda2d2.319ba714@aol.com>


Nora, Fitz is just a corruption of fils or filles the French for
son/daughter of. So really like Mac.

Fitzroy families descended from various Kings of England so "son/daughter
of Royal". Princess Diana was descended from one of them.

I think it is the origin of the illegitimate Fitz idea.

All the other Fitz indicate Norman French except for FitzPatrick- supposedly
one of the two? Viking origin names in Ireland.
Quinny


-----Original Message-----
From: [mailto:]
Sent: Wednesday, 17 May 2006 8:07 AM
To:
Subject: Re: [DNA] Help Please - Irish Surnames


Thanks for the info, Jason. So, it looks like my husband's line (E3b)
incorporated the Norman's custom by using Fitz to indicate male heirs. I
wonder
when his surname changed from Gerardini to Geraldini? Perhaps it had to do
with
pronounciation, Italian vs Norman.

I had to laugh when you mentioned that Fitz may indicate illegitimacy. When

my husband and I were first engaged in 1973, I found an article in an Irish

American paper that said those families that spelled FitzGerald with a
capital
"G" (as he did) were descendants of illegitimate sons of lords. He was
appalled. I have since heard various versions of the name origin.

Nora



In a message dated 5/16/2006 12:21:48 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
(mailto:) writes:


E3b is also possible... I've found several E3b FitzGeralds. At least
some
FitzGeralds are possibly descended from the Italian Geraldini that had
moved
to Normandy sometime around the 10th century.

Some FitzGeralds match typical Irish R1b haplotypes. Some also match
seemingly continental R1b.

So we are looking at least 3 different origins for them but the patronymic
Fitz is definitely linked to the Normans.

E3b seems to spike notably around Roman settlements along the atlantic
facade but some are thought to have moved into the isles later with the
Normans
including a group of Sephardic Jews who left Spain.

Fitz originally meant "son of" but was later used to indicate illegitimate
children of royal individuals so some Fitz names may be entirely non-Norman
in
origin.







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