GENEALOGY-DNA-L ArchivesArchiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2006-06 > 1150157915
From: "George Haynes" <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] J2 Y-DNA project
Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2006 20:18:35 -0400
References: <firstname.lastname@example.org> <448D70C2.email@example.com>
When the J2 Y-DNA project was started I made a number of constructive
suggestions to the "project owner" and even offered access to some private
research. The gentleman then proceeded to summarily dismiss my offer
without even comment. As far as I can determine, he really only wants to
use the FTDNA project as a private data source for, as he states below, his
own personal "scientific research" from which he may make access "publicly
available, when conclusions can be made" or "studies are published."
Needless to say, I immediately withdrew my haplotype from that project.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alfred A. Aburto Jr." <>
Sent: Monday, June 12, 2006 9:48 AM
Subject: Re: [DNA] J2 Y-DNA project
> I can understand the issue regarding "privacy". One gets a sense of that
> from Ymatch where only about 47% of the people in the database show
> their markers. But on the other hand if people want to learn more about
> their genetic background the only way to do it is to gather information
> from other people! These "other" people, all over the world, willing
> share their genetic data so that knowledge is gained that is valuable to
> everyone. It is this free and open sharing of information by these
> "other" people that has allowed scientists to discover the migratory
> patterns and ancient history of mankind.
> Well, it is good that, when your study is done, you will release all the
> details of your research. Hopefully it will also be peer group reviewed
> by other scientists? I don't know if you plan to publish your results in
> a scientific journal though.
> It is not good though, that one person more or less "hogs" an entire
> haplogroup (J2) into one private venture on FTDNA. We need open and
> public J/J1/J2 haplogroup(s) on FTDNA or elsewhere. The Ysearch ID's do
> not need to be revealed. The whole public database would be completely
> anonymous without the Ysearch ID's! It would be totally open but just
> as secure as your copyrighted website.
> > J2 Y-DNA project wrote:
> >In recent months I haven't been subscribed to the list, as I devote most
of my spare time to my two projects. A project member has informed me that
some comments were made about the J2-DNA project, so I've subscribed to
make this post, since I think some clarification is needed (I'll be
unsubscribing again after this post, so any replies should be made to me
> > Since starting the J2DNA project, Bonnie has never once attempted to
communicate with me, and if she had I would have been more than happy to
clarify to her why the project results are for members only.
> > The J2DNA project results are for members only for two reasons, - the
most important is to protect the privacy of all members. I realise that
traditionally most people who DNA test have been genealogists, and want to
share their haplotype to make family connections, and it can seem
inexplicable to most that some people might not want to share their
haplotype - but not all people who DNA test are genealogists. Some people
test for primarily reasons of Anthropological interest (particularly now
with the Genographic Project), and not all these people want their
hapolotypes in the public domain. Different people from different cultural
backgrounds have different comfort levels in what information they feel
comfortable being disclosed in the public arena. The project is trying to
be culturally sensitive, and to protect the privacy of all participants.
Making the project open, would make all members haplotypes "public domain",
and thus members would then loose
> > control over what happens to their haplotype. Members that are happy
to have their haplotype in the public domain are free to enter their
haplotype details into public databases such as Y-search.
> > The project website clearly states that it aims to do scientific
research into J2 sub-clades. It also states that results will be made
publicly available, when conclusions can be made. The J2 project being
haplogroup based is a scientific rather than a genealogical project, and
does its best to follow scientific methods. How many scientific studies
make their raw data available before their studies are published?.
> > The project is currently entering its second phase of results analyses,
and when these data analysis are completed, these results will be publicly
announced & presented.
> > During the first results analysis phase, Network diagram analyses were
done for all project participants (and updated every 6 weeks). I have now
updated the home page of the project website to show the current 12 marker
> > Regards,
> > Costa. Tsirigakis
> > http://www.j2-ydnaproject.net/
> > http://www.greekdnaproject.net/
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