GENEALOGY-DNA-L ArchivesArchiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2006-07 > 1153676695
From: "Ken Nordtvedt" <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] German Saxon I Y-DNA
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2006 11:44:55 -0600
Are you talking "lower" Saxons or "upper" Saxons (Dresden, Leipzig, etc.)?
It seems the latter?
Your haplotype's major rareness is the "doubling" or LOH event which occured
at your 459, 464, CDY markers.
The Anglo-Saxon-like I1a really dominates the I1a population, even in SMGF
which tends to be Scandinavian oriented. The dominance of the Anglo-Saxon
type of I1a haplotype results, however, because so many of them migrated to
the British Isles and Scandinavia, and eventually America, as well as those
which stayed put back in Germany. There is no doubt; no other ethnic group
can match those of Irish and Scot ancestry in their interest in genetic
genealogy. They outnumber their population numbers in the public databases.
Less so in SMGF because the LDS missionaries were not as active in Scotland
and Ireland as they were in England, Scandinavia, and northern Germany.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, July 23, 2006 11:04 AM
Subject: [DNA] German Saxon I Y-DNA
Now that the German company DNA-Fingerprint is merging with FtDNA,
does that mean we will be seeing more eastern German Y-DNA results
posted? I have been disappointed in the low number of Y-DNA results
published on German names and it seems as if very few scientific studies
have been done on certain German communities, especially in Saxony.
Perhaps I have not found the information because I don't speak German.
Or it could be that the Germans or their universities are not interested in
population genetics, migration patterns or in genetic genealogy.
With at least 43 million self-reported German Americans, however,
there should be a higher interest though, because Americans typically
spend more money on genealogy than their European counterparts.
I am hoping there will be more advertisements from the FtDNA
DNA-Fingerprint merger in the German language now to spark interest
among German speaking countries.
I am interested in Saxon German Y-DNA, especially the I1a variety.
My Husband's last name is Scheibe, Y-Search number JB7T7. His
Y-DNA does not come close to matching other I1a DNA, but I would
assume that is because there hasn't been much Saxon Y-DNA of the
I variety that has been tested. I just checked the DasÖrtliche Telefonbuch
for Leipzig, a city of less than 500,000 and I came up with 99 listings for
the name Scheibe. In order to come to any conclusions about the
origins of the Anglo Saxon I1aAS variety, I would think a large scale
study would need to be done on an "indigenous" population, if it exists.
It may not have started in Saxony, but rather in France, or somewhere
else, but how could you guess with so little information?
When I look at Y-Match at DNA-Fingerprint, at this German company's
site, there are only 19 people listed as having 8 repeats at DYS 455 which
indicative of the I1a and some of these are probably of a Norse variety
rather than a German type.
According to the CIA World Factbook (which I only use for comparison
purposes) the German population is now 82,422,299. The Germans
estimate a higher population than this. Combining the populations of
the UK and Ireland I came up with a total population of 64,671,388.
There are significantly more surnames from the British Isles listed
at Y-search and other sites than German sounding surnames. Even the
Scandinavian-sounding surnames seem to outnumber the German.
The population in nearby Scandinavia is about 24 million.
I would think that to follow the migration of Anglo-Saxon DNA into
Scandinavia and the British Isles, you would need to identify and
study a much larger population of Germans carrying a typical Saxon
Kathy in California
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