Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2006-08 > 1155708837

Subject: Re: [DNA] New subscriber
Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 02:13:57 EDT

In a message dated 8/16/2006 12:33:08 A.M. Central Standard Time,

I'm new here. Do you have a web site where you explain what you are
doing in very short words with lots of pictures? I never was very
strong in science and most of the genetics I learned is long out of

I'm here because you were talking about a McCartan DNA line. I'm not
the prime McCartan researcher but I have the boards and list for
McCartan, which is not a common surname outside of County Down.

The DNA data we're talking about is part of a Trinity College study on
surnames spread across Ireland. You can see it on this link:


Data from McEvoy and Bradley 2006
Brian McEvoy, Daniel G. Bradley
Y-chromosomes and the extent of patrilineal ancestry in Irish surnames
Human Genetics 2006

Supplementary Information.xls

There are lots of McGuinness and some McCartan DNA samples in this file.

Trinity college also mentioned the McGuinness and McCartan families in an
article referenced above in Human genetics. Basically they said the DNA
proved the historical pedigree links between the two families.

If you'd like a copy of either of these files let me know and I can send
both by email. You can find the pedigrees for McGuinness, McCartan and O
Lynch in the O Clery Book of Genealogies at this link:


Go down to para. 1829.

This discussion started because Ethnoancestry has announced a new
"Pictish" DNA test. And traditional Irish sources have always said the Dal nAraidhe
of NE Ulster (of whom McGuinness and McCartan were a part) were Cruithin or
Picts. So far we haven't a peep out of Ethnoancestry about the haplotypes or
haplogoup associated with this Pictish DNA signature.

Ken Nordtfeldt has the best site on I haplogroup DNA.

_ (

Where the McGuinness and McCartan families fit into this picture is in
what he calls old I1c or I1b2a-Isles. The following description was taken from
this site:

"I1b2a-Isles is found almost exclusively in the British Isles, and heavily
from Scotland at that. In the SMGF database there were no haplotype pedigrees
of this variety originating on the continent.

Recently, however, a few Isles I1b2a haplotype were found M284+ which is
downstream of M223+; so they are I1b2a1 subclade. My original M284+ dna sample
came from a male with stated origins in the Basque population. Examination
of Portugese databases also suggests haplotypes which could be of the M284+
subclade. Testing of key haplotypes from this Iberian region are needed.
I1b2a1 is a candidate haplogroup which may have arrived in the British Isles in
pre-Roman times, and perhaps directly from more southwesterly Europe instead
of Anglo-Saxon or Scandinavian sources."

Patrick Guinness says he is writing a book on the Dal nAraidhe DNA called
"The Irish Gene" but so far we have no response from him on possible publication

I'm sure others would be better equipped to answer specific technical
questions you might have; I just thought I'd fill you in on why the McGuinness
and McCartans came up in the first place.


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