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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2007-08 > 1185973685


From: John Plant <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] Famous DNA - the Plantagenet Y-DNA project
Date: Wed, 01 Aug 2007 14:08:05 +0100
References: <BAY105-F16497C5DDF9186B5F9EFA0CCE80@phx.gbl>
In-Reply-To: <BAY105-F16497C5DDF9186B5F9EFA0CCE80@phx.gbl>


Sorry Steve, I do not know. Perhaps someone else on the list might.

I do not know if you are aware of the "Famous DNA" web site at:

http://www.isogg.org/famousdna.htm

Unfortunately, there are not many famous people on that list so far.

Again, at a bit of a tangent, there was a bit of discussion in
connection with Elizabet I at:

http://genforum.genealogy.com/plantagenet/messages/1475.htm

but that does not help with your question.

Best wishes,

John

Steven Bird wrote:
> Dear John,
>
> Thank you for your post and I wish you the best of success in your search
> for Geoffrey of Anjou's male descendants. On a bit of a tangent, are you
> aware of any such effort in the direction of identifying William the
> Conqueror's haplotype?
>
> Best regards,
>
> Steve Bird
>
>
>
>> From: John Plant <>
>> Reply-To:
>> To:
>> Subject: [DNA] Famous DNA - the Plantagenet Y-DNA project
>> Date: Wed, 01 Aug 2007 10:36:09 +0100
>>
>>
>> A partly fulfilled aim has been to reach a better understanding of
>> Plant-like names in general. A remaining aim of the Plantagenet project
>> is to establish a Y-DNA signature for the late-medieval kings of England.
>>
>> This project was begun in 2001 with the Oxford Ancestors testing
>> company; but, because the Plant/Plantt haplotype is close to the WAMH as
>> it is now known, we soon converted to the higher marker tests offered by
>> FamilyTreeDNA. At the 25 marker level, the modal haplotype for
>> Plant/Plantt is unique (according to the Ysearch database), being a
>> genetic distance of 7 from the WAMH, though the same cannot be said for
>> some members with the Warren surname which is also relevant to this
>> project.
>>
>> Right from the outset, six out of seven of the miscellaneous Plants who
>> were tested matched and the trend continued to eleven out of twenty,
>> indicating that Plant was a single-ancestor, rather than a multi-origin,
>> surname; this led on to a publication in the academic journal, Nomina
>> [John S Plant (2005) `Modern methods and a controversial surname:
>> Plant', Nomina, 28, pp 115-33] in which I argued, on the basis of the
>> DNA and name-distribution evidence, that Plant/Plantt had the Welsh
>> borderlands meaning `offspring' rather than one of various other
>> meanings, including `gardener', that had earlier been suggested in
>> Surname Dictionaries. The new finding seemed to have implications for
>> Plant-like names more generally and, in a further publication soon to
>> appear, I have argued that generative (offspring) aspects of the
>> vegetable soul, which was important in late-medieval beliefs, played a
>> significant role in the adoption of the royal Plantagenet name.
>>
>> Throughout this time, I have also been attempting to establish a Y-DNA
>> signature for the Plantagenets. There have been published claims that
>> the names Somerset, Cornwell, Warren and, more contentiously,
>> Plant/Plantt, all descend down male-to-male lines from the Plantagenet
>> family. However, Cornwell and Warren appear to be multi-origin surnames
>> and there is no convincing basis for taking any particular result as
>> being the inherited Plantagenet Y-DNA signature. It is probably the
>> Somerset family, including such illustrious members as the Duke of
>> Beaufort and Lord Raglan, who hold the best claim to being intact
>> male-line descendants of the Plantagenets; but, there is no Y-DNA result
>> to report for them so far.
>>
>> The study already illustrates how Y-DNA results for a very ordinary
>> surname, such as Plant, can lead on to the reappraisal of matters of
>> some historical significance. Following on from my Nomina 28 paper I am
>> publishing a further paper in Volume 30 of Nomina: in this, I conclude
>> (on the basis of evidence too lengthy to repeat here) that it seems that
>> Plantagenet had "a `hairy broom shoot' implication of virility, strong
>> limbs, and a robust constitution, with bawdy connotations of virility
>> that evidently delayed the name's acceptance until late in this
>> dynasty's reign" [John S Plant (2007) `The tardy adoption of the
>> Plantagenet surname', Nomina, to appear in Vol 30, pp 57-84].
>>
>> Some recent discussion of the Plantagenet Y-DNA project can be found in
>> a thread at:
>>
>> http://genforum.genealogy.com/plantagenet/messages/1477.html
>>
>> A current task is to obtain a list of addresses for the Somerset family
>> so that they can be encouraged to be Y-DNA tested. In order to break the
>> ice, I am planning to send them a copy of my Nomina 30 paper about the
>> Plantagenet name. I have tried approaching Prof Bryan Sykes, Chris
>> Pomery and others to join this quest, since they might carry more weight
>> than me in an official approach to the nobility; but, in the absence of
>> a more eminent person, it would seem that this task might fall to me. A
>> few addresses for the Somersets are given at:
>>
>> http://www.thepeerage.com/i1249.htm
>>
>> http://www.worldroots.com/foundation/britain/henrybeaufortgen1436.htm
>>
>> and Somerset volunteers are welcome to sign up for a Y-DNA test at:
>>
>> https://www.familytreedna.com/surname_join.aspx?code=W51509&special=true
>>
>> Any contributions towards the objectives of this project would be welcome.
>>
>> Dr John S Plant
>> Co-ordinator of Plant-like names project
>>
>>
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--
.
. John S Plant BSc PhD MBCS CITP MInstP MIDI KLUO
Computing, Finance & IT Directorate, Keele University, England, ST5 5BG.

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