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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2007-10 > 1192833652


From: "Ken Nordtvedt" <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] Response to genetic genealogists from authors ofOct. 19thScience article
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 16:40:52 -0600
References: <7.0.1.0.2.20071019121224.02154e80@nature.berkeley.edu><E82B04D7-6A1E-4444-AD1B-6AB3695E05D0@utoronto.ca><REME20071019171153@alum.mit.edu><8AD56379-1ECC-43A1-A303-E5DB156967F7@utoronto.ca>


Gabriela, I agree with what you say about heritage; it is basically a
cultural and family thing rather than genetic thing.

However, I checked your haplotype and it looks I1b2a3, P78+, whose presence
in Eastern Europe and centered in Slovakia is clear. Perhaps you have had a
P78 test and found negative, so are backed upstream to I1b2a? But without
such a test, I'd suggest P78+

There is a reason to do ydna testing and research other than standard
genealogy. That would be population studies and possibly connecting one's
haplotype to more ancient tribes or places (not specific families now lost
to history).

Ken


----- Original Message -----
From: "Gabriela Novak" <>
To: <>
Sent: Friday, October 19, 2007 4:24 PM
Subject: Re: [DNA] Response to genetic genealogists from authors ofOct. 19th
Science article


> But isn't this why people want to do the testing in the first place?
> To confirm their research? If there was no chance of error in results
> from classical genealogy research, there would be no reason to test
> the DNA. So going for DNA test means that we are aware that there is
> a likelihood that the test will not confirm the data.
>
> Heritage is not in your genes, it is by definition the environment
> you grew up with and/or identify with. Don't people realize heritage
> is more than just your Y or mtDNA? That your other chromosomes
> contribute far more than your Y or mt-DNA and that those are a mix of
> pieces of DNA inherited from a large group of ancestors?
>
> For example, my dad is from Moravia in Czech Republic. We had his Y-
> DNA done and it came back as I1b2a, a very uncommon haplogroup in
> Czech. So his paternal line probably ultimately came from north
> western Europe. (I suspected that because his gggrandfather was not
> Czech, but of unknown origin). Do I feel that I have any less
> Moravian heritage? No, his dad was as Moravian as it gets and taught
> us to love that heritage. Besides, the gggrandfather contributed on
> average only 6.25% to my father's genome and the rest of my dad's
> chromosomes are from the Moravian/Czech population.
>
> If one has so much at stake, as to lose his whole identity because of
> a DNA test that disproves one of his many ancestors being from a
> specific group, then that person should probably not risk taking the
> test in the first place. Although if that is the case, I suspect that
> there are deeper problems to deal with.
>
> I think that most people have a pretty balanced outlook on DNA
> testing and its results and that the article took an extreme view,
> quite unjust to the field.
>
> Gabriela
>
>
>
> On 19-Oct-07, at 5:12 PM, John Chandler wrote:
>
>> Gabriela wrote:
>>> From the article:
>>>
>>> "Test-takers may reshape their personal identities, and they may
>>> suffer emotional distress if test results are unexpected or
>>> undesired" - I have yet to see any evidence of that, this is fear
>>> mongering.
>>
>> Actually, this is true, and I have seen it happen. A large amount
>> of genealogy is done cooperatively by groups sharing a common
>> ancestor. Under these conditions, the members of a group have a
>> big investment in the shared heritage, and the discovery that one
>> or more members do not really share that heritage can shake the
>> group as well as re-orient the affected members. If it were simply
>> a matter of a previously unsuspected false paternity, the cultural
>> and familial heritage would still be shared, but the fact is that
>> genetic disproofs often signify that the supposed connection was
>> based on a genealogical blunder all along.
>>
>> John Chandler
>>
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