Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2008-04 > 1208711130

From: "David Faux" <>
Subject: [DNA] R1b1c10 and DYS492
Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2008 10:05:30 -0700

This is basically part 4 of a series of postings on what we can say about
R1b1c10 at this point.

The database at now contains 114
entries of whom 90 can trace their ancestry to a European country. There
appears to be only one marker that is going to be informative, and which
parses this haplogroup into two.

DYS492 = 12 is modal for all R1b1c groups except R1b1c9 where a repeat value
of 13 predominates. R1b1c10 is over 3/4 modal at this point (with very
biased testing in favor of Britain and Ireland). It does appear to offer
some geographical specificity. This marker is found in the last panel of
FTDNA's 67 marker suite.

The "hotspot" is clearly a band through southern Gemany to Belgium via
Luxembourg. The percentage of DYS492=14 is over 50% in these areas. It has
been found in one Italian whose roots, although in Sicily, are supposed to
extend to Northern Italy in the Middle Ages. The rest of the Italian group
is 12. All of the Swiss are 12 (4 have 67 markers) as are to date all of
the French (N=1 with 67 markers). Of the many English and Scots tested only
one has a value of 14 (and he with a very long Colonial USA pedigree). All
those with grandfathers, father or themselves born in England have 12. All
of the non-Jewish Eastern Europeans (Poland, Ukraine, Czech Republic,
Hungary) have DYS492=12. My guess is that this group represents the Celtic
migrants who are documented in those areas from prior to 250 BC and who
largely came from the Marne - Champagne area of France (and points westward)
and Switzerland as well as Bohemia (based on the archaeological record).

The Ashkenazi of Eastern Europe have an entirely different migrational
pathway and time stamp. It is likely that many came from southern Germany
(the first documentation of a Jewish presence north of the Alps being 391 AD
in Cologne and soon after Worms and Mainz). Hence the relatively high
percentage of DYS492 = 14 in this community is not surprising and may be
giving an important clue as to early origins relating to European (Celtic)
This will do for now as I await further data.

David K. Faux.

This thread: