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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2008-04 > 1208875289


From: Thomas Gull <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] R1bc19* Frisian or Norway
Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:41:29 -0400
References: <002201c8a3de$f1be31e0$0401a8c0@KENDZIORA><BAY106-W486D1B1B58128B3F090923BCE10@phx.gbl><000601c8a46c$b1897ce0$0401a8c0@KENDZIORA> <ea3bd9560804220651h3b5bee3aufe76166935440002@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <ea3bd9560804220651h3b5bee3aufe76166935440002@mail.gmail.com>


Thanks, David. Actually, I don't remember you personally ever using a Norway label for this group, and I didn't make that clear even though my mention of you as a source of a datapoint was technically accurate. It just wasn't complete enough <g>. Other people took your passing mention of Norway's statistic on your website and extrapolated that into the label on their own. / Tom> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2008 06:51:47 -0700> From: > To: > Subject: Re: [DNA] R1bc19* Frisian or Norway> > Since I am am being named as a perpetrator in this effort to find a "tag"> for R1b1c9, I suppose I should weigh in. Based on the published (Myres et> al., 2007) and unpublished data I would think that "Northern Germanic" is> the best descriptor at this point.> > David K. Faux.> > > On 4/22/08, Christopher Atkinson <>> wrote:> >> > Just a quick thanks to those who addressed my question.> > appreciated,> > chris> >> > ----- Original Message -----> > From: "Thomas Gull" <>> > To: <>> > Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 8:08 PM> > Subject: Re: [DNA] R1bc19* Frisian or Norway> >> >> > >> > > The jury is definitely still out on R1b1c9.> > >> > > I think the "Norway/Frisian" label for this subclade is an old label> > whose> > > use should be discontinued, and I'd recommend the tree be updated> > without> > > the label. Of the 110 some people in the FTDNA U106 (R1b1c9) project so> > > far, at most 25 % fall into the so-called "Frisian STR cluster". I> > don't> > > remember any of the project members being from Norway, and I don't think> > > anyone has established a "Norway STR cluster" for R1b1c that I've seen> > > referenced. The labels got hung on R1b1c9 early on from the first 6-8> > or> > > so confirmed individuals who mostly did belong to the "Frisian STR> > > cluster", and a report by David Faux based on unpublished data that> > about> > > 2/3 of Norwegian R1b1c was R1b1c9.> > >> > > To the degree that a label has to be hung on this subclade, the current> > > one in vogue is probably "northern Germanic". As more data arrives, the> > > reality of the origins and current locations for this group will become> > > much clearer. For now, everyone is speculating about R1b1c9 and all> > > labels should be taken with a huge grain of salt. Better to look at the> > > raw datapoints and discussion than to worry about the label accuracy> > <g>.> > >> > > / Tom Gull> From: > To:> > > > Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2008 19:38:48 +0100>> > > Subject: [DNA] R1bc19* Frisian or Norway> > I've just been looking at a> > > great new tree from Dennis Wright> > > http://www.geocities.com/irishtypeiii/R_Tree.xls which lists R1b1c9* as> > > Norway/Frisian. I have been told that my haplogroup is a non frisian> > form> > > of R1b1c9*. Is the feeling then that this is a possible Norse/Viking> > line> > > & the Frisian a possible AngloSaxon Line? Am I as ever being far too> > > simplistic? Is the current thinking that in Britain is post Viking or> > > Anglo Saxon invasion R1b1c9* ? Or is the jury still out? I know that> > this> > > is an ever changing field of research but would like the latest> > thoughts.>> > > All the best,> Chris> > -- > I am using the free version of SPAMfighter> > > for private users.> It has removed 1101 spam emails to date.> Paying> > users> > > do not have this message in their emails.> Get the free SPAMfighter> > here:> > > http://www.spamfighter.com/!>; > > len> > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list,> > > please send an email to with the word> > > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the> > > message> >> > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

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