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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2008-04 > 1209053747


From: Thomas Krahn <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] Transparency (was R1b1c test for S3, S10, S13, S17)
Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2008 11:15:58 -0500
References: <941019.84426.qm@web413.biz.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <A28BDBEA-0B51-4DB1-B864-5339DB356D07@vizachero.com> <C4C2B4C0-8537-4D5B-A0F1-223096F31520@vizachero.com> <jzsbw6.yiwcj6@webmail.variomedia.de> <D44900C1-F1A2-4C98-8C24-DC83257933ED@vizachero.com> <480F7CB0.20305@sbcglobal.net><jzsnpq.v3byei@webmail.variomedia.de><ea3bd9560804232321s1f87e65fh65d688d53e99dddb@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <ea3bd9560804232321s1f87e65fh65d688d53e99dddb@mail.gmail.com>


Dear David,

Again, it's not my intention to reduce the income of EA.
On contrary: In my experience sales increase when the molecular data of
a marker are published.
I don't think the market is saturated for innovative products.

David Faux wrote:
> FTDNA is already a Goliath.
We are well aware that David can beat Goliath. ;)
> Is diminuitive EA to be allowed nothing but
> crumbs? In the meanwhile FTDNA continues to add the EA products to their
> line and EA derives absolutely no benefits for all of their efforts since
> the rug is pulled out from under them. By the way where are all of those P
> markers published. Why do researchers have to dig in obscure places or call
> in favors to obtain the sequencs from your associates at the U of Arizona.
> Are they not all supposed to be deposited in dbSNP? Is there a double
> standard?
>
Here are all markers published together:
http://ymap.ftdna.com

It's even possible to download a complete list of all markers on the Y
chromosome in a file like Ron Scott did.
Even the primer information is available there.
> When EA developed its "Works" SNP package (as well as many other offerings),
> FTDNA came out with their own version within months and provided a chart
> showing how much better their package was (conveniently forgetting that they
> were not offering markers such as S21 and S28 at the time). FTDNA could not
> offer S21 and S28 until they were published. If Jim had published the
> sequences earlier they they would have been gobbled up by FTDNA and everyone
> would jump to test with FTDNA and EA is again left out in the cold. If
> people are not careful, and heed your call to send all their business to
> FTDNA, the only company in the world at the moment who could step in and
> take over all of the SNP testing done by FTDNA could shrivel and die. Then
> what would happen if some unforseen circumstance befell the larger company
> in these tight ecomonic times.
>
>
David, remember that both companies have been copying each others
markers. Many of the other markers that EA offers have been developed by
the Hammer lab in Arizona.
I think it is good that both companies offer both markers. This gives
the customers the chance of a second opinion.

> I have no vested interest in this except to ensure that both FTDNA and EA
> remain healthy - I do business with both. As you know EA is always on the
> lookout for new and informative markers. As I read the e-mail below you are
> giving "instructions", as an executive of FTDNA, to avoid innovative markers
> (placed on the chart by correct means under perhaps, I am not sure, the
> supervision of Dr. David Goldstein) is ultimately going to be counter
> productive. Frankly I would like to see some cooperative venture between
> FTDNA and EA, not the former trying, by any and all means, to edge the other
> out of the business. The genetic genealogy community would better benefit
> if agreements were signed and good relations fostered, as was the case
> between EA and DNA-Fingerprint before the move from Germany. Perhaps the
> "business oriented head" of FTDNA would wish to approach EA and see if any
> mutually agreeable arrangement can be struck. Hey, whatever works for the
> greater good or our community - then I am all for it.
>
As a customer I wouldn't like to see FTDNA and EA making contracts.
However I already offered that FTDNA will not test for S3, S10, S13 and
S17 for a year if EA gives the SNP positions.

Thomas

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