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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2008-05 > 1211556282


From: "Dan D." <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] S21/S28 Split+m223 stuff
Date: Fri, 23 May 2008 11:24:42 -0400
References: <BAY111-DAV57869AAE0F5A21D479FCEB1C10@phx.gbl><BLU146-DAV713718582B123DED9ADE48DC10@phx.gbl> <BAY106-W17032E455761EEEE949F2BBCC10@phx.gbl>
In-Reply-To: <BAY106-W17032E455761EEEE949F2BBCC10@phx.gbl>


Tom,

This is nothing more than tool based on the RAO matches indicated on my FTDNA page. It allows me to visualise match densities, based on each level of genetic distances. It is not to determine the source of R1b1b2g, only to determine which members are closer to me, and at what densities, based on the number of matches from a particular country, relative to the total number of tested from that country. Nothing fancy, just a tool, like any other... It is the same as trying to determine ages for the TMRCA, the results will be as good as the data available.It was just a suggestion for others who are interested. Obviously, it is not for everyone...
Dan



> From: > To: > Date: Thu, 22 May 2008 22:58:51 -0400> Subject: Re: [DNA] S21/S28 Split+m223 stuff> > > Dan, I'm not sure I understand how this relates to trying to determine the geographic area where R1b1b2g originated or started to noticeably expand. The haplotypes for the U106+ group show a great deal of variance, to say the least. So this technique sounds like it gives entirely different results depending on how close the haplotype you start with (yours in this case) matches the group's modal, such as it is. My own haplotype ranges from 15 to 35-40 GD from every other one in the U106+ project. RAO shows me with matches all over the place at 12 markers with a concentration in the UK. When you switch to 25 markers, I drop to a couple of handfuls of 0-1 marker matches, now in Sweden, Italy, England, etc. A diagram in DNA-forums (by Vince, I think) indicated very clearly that the clade members are spread all over the place and don't cluster closely in terms of a network. I think it also indicated that the association of U106+ as the "Frisian cluster group" is much oversta!> ted - I think only 20-25% of the group members were in that cluster based on haplotypes.> > Anyway, it sounds like you're using your own haplotype kind of like the Cambridge Reference Sequence was used on the mtDNA side and I'm not sure why that yields any good geographic indicator for the clade expansion. Am I missing something or is that not what you were actually after with this technique?> > Thanks / Tom> > ======================================================> > Date: Thu, 22 May 2008 21:49:53 -0400> > From: > > To: > > Subject: Re: [DNA] S21/S28 Split+m223 stuff> >> > I agree. Austria contains Vienna as large populous city, where many other> > ethnicities blended in, during centuries, "acquiring" Germanity.> >> > For my personal matches I tend to update a spreadsheet based on the RAO> > matches, as a percentage of tested members from each country and region,> > then aggregated at country levels. Although subjective and imperfect, it> > gives an idea keeping things somewhat relatively equal. So far, for my> > R1b1b2g haplogroup Belgium seems to offer the highest percentage for my> > matches. I keep these matches at every genetic distance level, as per FTDNA> > s RAO table structure. I do ignore cases where less than matches are> > available.> >> > Dan> >> > > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
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