Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2008-06 > 1213280537

From: Bill Howard <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] How could we tell?
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2008 10:22:17 -0400
References: <01cd01c8cc11$85eb2670$6400a8c0@Ken1><00b901c8cc47$65dc7470$6401a8c0@HP><>
In-Reply-To: <>

I must say I am rather appalled at all the traffic about how to send
false names, etc. into the testing agencies.
There is no evidence that I know of that tests are being run under
false pretenses. So many people are involved at the testing end that I
think we would hear of it pretty soon if it became a problem. This
exercise is only a theoretical proposition that got these discussions
started to begin with, but it is doing testing, and this List posters,
no service in the long run.
Let's trust the system unless there is evidence to the contrary.
Otherwise, we will start some real mischief that the fringes of our
society will find ways to exploit. Why give them lessons when there
is no problem in evidence......?
- Bye from Bill Howard

On Jun 12, 2008, at 10:06 AM, wrote:

> The only problem with sending in a false name by the same person, is
> that the same person is paying for the test. They (those testing
> know who pays for the test) will know that. If you are going to do
> that you have to have someone else submit the name, the test and pay
> for it. Other wise is is truly not a control subject.
> -------------- Original message from "Diana Gale Matthiesen" <
> >: --------------
>> Have the same person send in a second sample, and have them give a
>> false name.
>> If the results don't match, you know they're not really running any
>> tests.
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: On Behalf Of Ken Nordtvedt
>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 11, 2008 6:22 PM
>>> To:
>>> Subject: [DNA] How could we tell?
>>> Suppose we were reduced to a single testing company? I just
>>> woke from an afternoon nap --- the snow, rain, and wind here
>>> is so ferocious there was not much else to do. I had a
>>> quasi-dream about a wonderful spoof a single testing company
>>> could play on us all.
>>> Suppose they never did a lab measurement, but instead had a
>>> well done computer program that just generated "results" for
>>> us according to some decent mathematical rules which mimick
>>> what STR markers would do. They had a whole virtual
>>> construction of mankind's tree of ydna and mtdna, its
>>> "history", and the geographical distributions it leaves
>>> today, and of course the narratives we read about to go along
>>> with it. They kept track via the LDS genealogical records,
>>> etc., how close we are to others of our surnames,
>>> etc........, so their computer could spit out reasonable GDs
>>> among ourselves. And on and on. Actually, it might cost a
>>> company more to run the spoof than to just test us for what
>>> we really are, although I'm not sure.
>>> How would we go about exposing such a spoof?
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