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From: Dienekes Pontikos <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] How old is Y-Chromosome Adam?
Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2010 19:18:35 +0200
References: <AANLkTikwdqMnD_7GhV2qq7SAnveR_oSc_tUMLEy_PrM+@mail.gmail.com><4D1CBB75.9020904@wells.org>
In-Reply-To: <4D1CBB75.9020904@wells.org>


The Qesem cave finds' significance has been inflated by the media

http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2010/12/400-200ka-dental-remains-from-qesem.html
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/12/beware-of-british-newspapers-fossils-edition/
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/29/oldest-homo-sapiens-fossil-journalistic-vaporware/

On Thu, Dec 30, 2010 at 7:03 PM, Orin Wells <> wrote:
> A recent discovery may already have been discussed on this list and I
> missed it.  This is certainly going to cause many to re-think both the
> "ancient out of Africa" theory and just how long ago "Adam" may have
> lived as well as where.
>
> The dates listed in the article referenced by Robert of 300,000 years
> and 575,000 years may not be so far off as some would think.
>
> In Qesem cave near Rosh Ha'Ayin, 10 miles from Ben-Gurion airport east
> of Tel Aviv, a team of international archeologists under the auspices of
> Tel Aviv University have discovered 8 teeth.  Not so unusual except
> these teeth have been estimated to be about 400,000 years old and are
> the teeth of  Homo Sapiens aka modern man.
>
> The study was funded by the government of Spain, the American Museum of
> Natural History, the Israel Science Foundation and philanthropic groups,
> including the Irene Levi Sala CARE Archaeological Foundation and the
> Leakey Foundation.
>
> Along with the teeth -- the parts of the human skeleton that survive the
> longest -- the researchers found evidence of a sophisticated early human
> society that used sharpened flakes of stone to cut meat and other
> impressive prehistoric tools.
>
> Until this discovery it had been believed by scientists that man evolved
> no more than 200,000 years ago in Africa and migrated north between
> 150,000 and 200,000 years ago.  Possibly as late as 70,000 years ago.
> This discovery will now cause scientists to reconsider as it indicates
> man may have originated in the Middle East.  Of course we do not know
> how this will mesh with bible accounts.   Did Adam live more than
> 400,000 years ago?
>
> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1341973/Did-humans-come-Middle-East-Africa-Scientists-forced-write-evolution-modern-man.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
>
> And you thought it was difficult trying to get a grip on ancestors 6,000
> or 70,000 years ago.  Just try to trace your ancestors back to this point!
>
> On 12/30/2010 7:58 AM, Robert Hughes wrote:
>> How old is Y-chromosome Adam?
>> Dienekes has a thoughtful post in his December-30-2010 blog about
>> finding the age of Y-Chromosome Adam with a little help from Tim
>> Janzen.
>> Dienekes writes in part:
>> The presumed shallow time depth of the human Y-chromosome phylogeny is
>> one of the main arguments of the recent Out-of-Africa theory. One of
>> the major things I found while working on my Y-STR series is that
>> point estimates from Y-STR variation are associated with huge
>> confidence intervals, because of uncertainty about factors such as
>> generation length, population history, mutation rates, even if the
>> mutation model behaves "perfectly" in symmetrical stepwise fashion.
>> More at the link below.
>> Link:  http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2010/12/how-old-is-y-chromosome-adam.html
>> Regards, Robert
>> When I told my doctor about my memory loss, he made me pay in advance.
>>
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--
Dienekes' Anthropology Blog: http://dienekes.blogspot.com
Dodecad Ancestry Project: http://dodecad.blogspot.com


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