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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2011-05 > 1304932379


From:
Subject: Re: [DNA] Re : Re : new earliest I tree structure
Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 11:12:59 +0200 (CEST)
In-Reply-To: <348260.72585.qm@web26202.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>


You can check it on Adriano Squecco excel file.
A is ancestral and C is derived.
On this file there are 3 I2 negative to L460, 19 positive, and 48 with no-calls.

Sincerely,

Itaï Perez.


----- vernade didier <> a écrit :
> Unfortunately, I had a "no call" on rs7892855. No big deal for me as I am not in I haplogroup anyway but I don't know which allele is ancestral and which is derived.
>
>
> > This post on I haplogroup didn't
> > receive many comments it seems. I just realized that L460 is
> > rs7892855  on 23andME v3 . This is a typical case where
> > 23andME reactivity is low : while they have the SNP that
> > make the break , it may take a long time before the
> > conclusion reaches customers.
> >
> > Didier
> >
> > > Finally the key L460 test result was
> > > reported out last night from FTDNA.  A quite
> > different
> > > I2* haplotype (from Georgia in Caucasus) confirmed
> > the
> > > ancestral L460- first found in the 23andMe test of dna
> > from
> > > St Petersburg Russia.  The latter fits into the
> > quite
> > > different Jewish clade of I2*  The new I2 is defined
> > as
> > > the haplogroup ancestral for L460 but derived for the
> > > M438=S31=P215 snp which defines all of
> > I2.............
> > >
> > > In the meantime 23andMe had accumulated more than a
> > dozen
> > > derived L460+ results from folks in the various
> > I2a..... and
> > > I2b.... clades (..... means any additional downstream
> > > designations)   This means the early time
> > > structure of haplogroup I tree is changed from what I
> > > thought it would be from STR interclade variance or
> > GD
> > > considerations.  The I2 branch line is even more
> > > ancient now.  Four branch lines to i1, I2a, I2, I2b
> > > separate from each other at about the same time 20,000
> > years
> > > ago.  The node where the I2a and I2b branch lines
> > > separate being the latest event. 
> > >
> > > This is the first time in the early I tree when snp
> > > evidence contradicted the inference from earlier
> > acquired
> > > STR evidence concerning temporal order of tree nodes.
> > >
> > > You can see the revised I tree as warpedfounderstree2
> > at my
> > > website http://knordtvedt.home.bresnan.net 
> > >
> > > The approximately common separation of haplogroup I
> > into
> > > four branches 20,000 years ago probably has some
> > > implications for our speculations of how haplogroup I
> > spread
> > > in Europe (and Anatolia) so long ago.
> > >
> > > I include one possible haplogroup renaming required
> > for the
> > > old I2a.... and I2b.... haplogroups.  Note how
> > massive
> > > is this required renaming.  People won’t like the
> > new
> > > confusion, and no doubt ISOGG and other more official
> > folks
> > > will do the renaming differently because they retain
> > > private-like snps in their trees which I do not keep
> > in my
> > > tree.  Probably best to refer to last snp or two to
> > > identify haplogroups now.  For instance; the old
> > > I2a2b-Dinaric can be called simply L69+ L147+
> > >
> > > Note that I2 is now also split between the original
> > three
> > > divisions, A,B,C, and the demographically small and
> > > relatively newly found ADR clade.  Three snps L415,
> > > L416, L417 found in a WTY test define the ADR clade
> > which
> > > becomes I2b in the new nomenclature.
> > >
> > > Ken
> > >
> > >
> > > 
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