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From: "Richard A. Pence" <>
Subject: Re: Numbering system?
Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 05:56:10 -0700


FitzAlan <> wrote:

> You've probably heard of the Ahnentafel numbering system. I'm
> #1, my dad is #2, my mom #3. Her father is #6 and mom #7. My
> dad's dad is #4 and mom #5.

> Of course, as you can see, you can number your cousins therein
> easily.

?? How do we do that? There is no provision for numbering anyone
but ancestors in an ahnentafel - that's all it is, an "ancestor
table."


> There is a register format. Where the Ancestor is #1, and the
> descendants are sequentially numbered downwards. Father 1,
> children 2, 3, +4, 5, +6. The plus would denote children with
> (recorded) children of their own. From 4, we would have then 7,
> 8, and so on.

Actually, what you describe is the Record System. The Register
system does not include an Arabic number for persons whose lines are
not carried on. The Record System is the one which numbers everyone
and uses the + sign to indicate which lines are carried on.


> If you use software to do your genealogy, you don't have to
> worry about the numbering. Every individual has their own
> unique id#. It doesn't matter what the particular number is, the
> individual is kept in the proper family by the software, not the
> number.

> Then, based on the reports you do, you can have any number of
> resulting numbers therefrem. Ahnentafel numbers, register
> number, etc.

> Too, since every individual has his or her own number, storing
> information "off-line" on them is as easy as creating a folder with
> their number on it. I get a lot of information on-line and bring it
> into spreadsheets. I create a column in the spreadsheet, and
> store my id#'s therein. (My Smock Marriages in KY to 1850 file
> is about 1/4 populated with Smock's in my file.)

And what do you do if you "pack" your database to eliminate
"empties" for deleted individuals, or export your data to GEDCOM and
then import it (and there are many reasons this is done)? Everyone
now has a new ID number and your off-line files have numbers that
are unrelated to anything in the database.


> Anyway, in short, don't worry about numbering you kindred. Let
> software do that for you.

Each computer program has a method for keeping track of the
individuals in the database. If ID numbers are used, these are
transitory and can't be relied on for permanent recordkeeping
outside of the computer. Further, they are usually randomly
generated numbers and carry no uniformitory or other characteristics
that make them useful for humans.

There are a lot of advantages to assigning "permanent" IDs which
carry within them some information about the person and his
ancestry, as can be done with a Henry System. I have been doing
this for 22 years in organizing my one-name PENCE study. The added
information given by these numbers makes not only the management of
the huge databases involved much easier, but they also simply the
seach-and-identify process involved in responding to queries. And
they tie the individual to a permanent file.

Granted, my system was developed of necessity in the days when there
were no genealogy programs - lord, there weren't even any database
management programs then - so everything had to be put in tiny word
processor files (made necessary by memory that was measured in the
low Ks). Fortunately, I had used enough foresignt - and a good ID
numbering system - in creating these text files that it wasn't too
had to build database indexes to them.

Even with the availability of software tailored for genealogy, I
have clung to the method I developed before their advent and - with
the full knowledge that what I have could be greatly improved - in
many ways what I have is superior to using a genealogy program,
particularly when it comes to matching the computer entries to the
off-line paper back-up.

My caveat from my previous message on this topic stands: If you are
going to assign "permanent" ID numbers to individuals, you are
better off not trying to mix ancestor genealogies with descendant
genealogies - no numbering system is suited to doing both.

Regards,
Richard A. Pence, 3211 Adams Ct, Fairfax, VA 22030
Voice 703-591-4243 Fax 703-385-0971
Pence Family History <http://www.pipeline.com/~richardpence/>;

"Richard A. Pence" <>

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