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Archiver > GRAMMAR > 1997-12 > 0881124499

Subject: Re: John Grammer
Date: Tue, 02 Dec 1997 22:48:19 -0600

Dear Alice:

You wrote:

> The thing that caught my eye in your message was that you have an
> ancestor Joel Grammer. There is a Joel Grammer in the Grammer
> family that is my line and that makes me wonder if there might be
> a connection. It would seem that Joel is not such a common name that
> it was used widely.

You are correct that Joel does not seem to be a name commonly used at that
time. However, Joel is a name that is quite common in my GRAMMER line.
The first instance I have of it was Sen. John GRAMMER's son Dr. Joel
GRAMMER (1809-1861) However, it was used quite often in my family line
after that, as were the names John, William, Jacob, Mary, Elizabeth and

> My John Grammer was born in VA, as far as we know. He was married
> to Elizabeth Abernathy in Dinwiddie Co., VA in 1792.

Sgt. John Grammer (also spelled at times as GRAMER) was born in Lancaster,
PA in 1750. He married Elizabeth (Unknown) in 1771. Among their children

William - (born 1774 and died 1828 in Union Co., IL)
John - (born 1780 in either NC or VA and died Nov 1849 in Union, Co.

(There were other children, but I do not yet have their names.)

Sgt. John Grammer died in Fayette County, KY in 1793. Someplace in my
files I have a copy of his will, in which his children (listed above) are

I have a great deal of information about the GRAMMERs in Illinois (and a
large variety of other places) and am in the process of trying to get it
put into my FTM program.

I started my search in 1981 and was very fortunate to have as a friend (and
a not so distant relative), an elderly gentleman named John Wright who had
done very extensive research on the GRAMMERs (his wife's family). He was
very generous and shared his research with me.

There was a saying in the Union/Jackson County area in Illinois, that you
couldn't throw a rock without hitting a GRAMMER.

Hope this helps!



X-Message: #2
Date: Tue, 02 Dec 1997 21:53:43 -0800
From: Alice Jackson <>
To: "Alice E. McCollum" <>
CC: ,
Message-ID: <>
Subject: Misc Grammer records
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Hi Alice. So glad that you responded.

Hello Karima. Received your message and was going to get some details
to send to you but Alice M. did it for me. Just want to add that "a"
John Grammer received a land grant of 40 in TN on Wartrace Creek in
1787(?) for his service in the Rev War. We have not had an opportuntity
to follow up on those Rev War records.

"Our" John Grammer was in the War of 1812--signed up in Fayettville TN.
His son, Peterson, was a drummer boy in that war. He died in 1840 in
Morgan Co, AL. He married Elizabeth Abernathy. We have the text of her
declaration claiming land for his service in the War of 1812. On the
1840 Morgan Co AL census, there was an Elizabeth Grammer. Also on that
census was a Leonard Grammer--assume her son Leonard m. Rosetta King.

Are you familiar with Rev. John Grammer,also, I believe, of Dinwiddie
Co VA? We have found various materials about him, but not about his

Found some early (misc) references to Grammer--unable to make any

The DAR Patriot Index--Centennial Edition part 2:
Grammer: Gramer
Jacob: b. 1749 PA d. 1815 MD. m. Catherine Schaeffer 1lt PS MD
John: b. 1754 VA d, 1835 VA. m. (1)Mary Timerlake (2) Priscilla
Withers CS VA
Joseph: b. 1754 PA d. 1832 MA m. Elizabeth Weber Smn PS PA

Personal Property list, Dinwiddie Co, 1782:
Peter Grammer 2 horses, 7 cattle

Poll of Amelia Co, VA 1768--
Joseph Grammer on Capt Robert Munford's Poll
Joseph Grammer on Col Thos Tabb's Poll

Index to the VA Revolutionary Publick Claims (page 102)
(This was not clear to me. Why no given name for the Grammer in
Dinwiddie Co???)

I may have some other misc references to Grammer's in VA in 1700's but I
keep jumping around and haven't gotten the data organized.

BTW, we have just joined your list. Have you been a member for long? I
was told that there were only about 9 members. I can't wait to hear
from some of the other members. Alice Jackson


X-Message: #3
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 1997 00:28:35 -0600
CC: "Alice E. McCollum" <>,

Message-ID: <>
Subject: Re: Joel A. Douglas GRAMMER (1808-1861)
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Dear Alice:

Thank you for your nice note to me. I thought I would share some of my
information on my Joel GRAMMER and his Alabama connection with the list.

Joel GRAMMER, was born in Ohio County, Kentucky, seventh of fifteen
children of Senator John and Juliet GRAMMER. The family moved to
Rutherford County, TN, when Joel was an infant, but was there only a short
time, probably leaving soon after the 1810 census, in which the family

In about 1811 they moved to Union County, IL. Joel left Union County about
1825, and eloped with Catherine Clapp. There is no marriage record for
them in Union County, and it is assumed they married en route. The story
goes that they went to Alabama to stay with relatives. Their first child,
John Wesley GRAMMER (my direct line) was born on Christmas day, 1825.
Another child was born in Alabama in 1827, and a third in 1829. The fourth
child was born in Kentucky in 1831.

Joel had probably practiced medicine in Alabama, or at least was studying
medicine, with whom is not known. The family returned to Union County in
1835. The 1840 Union County, IL census shows his wife as being in
Catherine's age range and shows a child born between 1835 and 1840. The
next record of the family in the 1850 census shows no children born between
1831 and 1843, and it may have been that they lost one or more to death.
Joel is shown as a widower in the 1850 census, by which year they had moved
to Jackson County, IL, where Joel was practicing medicine in Makanda and
Pomona Townships.

(I will continue with Dr. Joel GRAMMER's bio later).

Best regards,



X-Message: #4
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 1997 13:33:36 -0800
From: "Dawn & Jim" <>
To: <>
Message-ID: <01bd0033$1cf9b1a0$>
Subject: Fw: Grammer Family
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got this the yesterday, can anyone help?



-----Original Message-----
From: <>
To: <>
Date: Tuesday, December 02, 1997 1:46 PM
Subject: Grammer Family

>Hi, Dawn!
> I saw your email on the Rootsweb List, and I want to tell you my
>Grammer's just in case you recognize any of them. I am pretty much stuck
>this point.
>My husband's mother is Betty Sue Grammer, born l93l, Cherokee Co, TX
>Her father was John Wilson Grammer, born Aug. l908 Rusk, Cherokee Co, TX,
>died ll Aug. l959, Houston, Harris Co, TX
>His father was James Wiley Grammer, born 29 Jan. l849, died 9 April l9l9
> This is the extent of my information, and I am hoping they will ring a
>bell to you.
>Good Luck!
>Jane Heinrich
>Baytown, TX


X-Message: #5
Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 13:05:31 -0500 (EST)
cc: , , ,
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Message-ID: <>
Subject: Grammer connections

97-12-04 11:11 EST

Friends and Relations,

Jacob Grammer 1747-1813, who is listed in the DAR Patriot Index (Alice
Jackson email 12/3) was my third gg - b in Lancaster Co., PA - lived there
with his father Adam or Wm. Jacob, went to Westminster, MD, m Catherine
Schaeffer - had 10? children, Benjamin being my ancestor. Buried Krider's
Cemetery, Westminster

An 11 page document entitled DESCENDANTS OF WILLIAM JACOB GRAMMER, sent to
me by Johnny Evans with the admonition to be careful since he had found
mistakes and to document everything, prepared by Warren Grammer in TX has
the following which may be of interest to some of you.

Wm Jacob 1711-1783 m Shaine Mary Bach (His second wife I think) In Germany
Children: John Jacob Peter, Jacob (my ggg), Joseph Peterson, Mary S. and

John Jacob Peter 1730-1808 had son John Wm 1774-1821 who had son John Joel

I wrote to Warren in 1996 and asked for some documentation but never heard
from him. Bob Barnett has a disc of this file but in the Rootmaster format. I
hope to see it when I'm in FL in January and see if there is anything else in
it. Bob also indicates that "other sources indicates his (Wm Jacob) sons came
to MD and VA then one branch goes to PA and another to TN". That would about
tie us all together if true.



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