INDIA-L Archives

From: "Nick Balmer" <>
Subject: [India-L] John Baber died on Isle de France
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2003 22:26:39 +0100

Hello Marina and Phillippe,

I have gone back through all my notes, and tried to compile a summary of every thing I know about my ancestor John Baber 1786-1807 Lieutenant in the 8th Regiment of Bengal Native Infantry.

The first thing to say, is that I have discovered that I have made a mistake in my previous posts to you and the India List.when I mixed him up with his elder brother James Hervey Baber 1780-1819 who was an officer in the 16th Regiment of Madras Native Infantry. I am afraid that this was down to my writing from memory in my excitement at finding a potential correspondant with access to the Mauritian archives.

Althought there is some slight conflicts in dates, this could well be down to the time it took for letters to pass, or perhaps his date of death, in EIC records being the date at which they receved notification.

I have found a small amount about the French vessel on Google, which appears to have originally been an English vessel until its capture by the French in 1800.

I cannot find anything about the Phoenix. There was a Royal Naval frigate of 36 guns active at this period, but it seems to have stayed in European waters. There does not seem to be an East Indiaman of this name, so I presume it must have been a Country vessel.

I would be very grateful for any other comments or help that you can offer in finding information on the location that the capture took place.

Do you have a rough idea of how many other prisoners were being held in the Isles de France at this time?

Thank you so much for the help that you have given me by solving the mystery of my great great great uncles death.

Regards

Nick Balmer

JOHN BABER, (1783-1807)





John Baber[i] born 2rd March 1783[ii] in Leather Lane London. He was the youngest son of Thomas Baber, an Attorney at the Inner Temple, and Elizabeth Baber, nee Berriman.



Thomas and Elizabeth Baber already had four sons Henry Hervey Baber, Thomas Hervey Baber, William Baber and James Baber when John was born.



However tragedy struck the family only twelve days later when William his brother died aged about three on 14th March 1783.





1783

8



John Baber born March 2nd



William Baber died March 14th.[iii]





John's elder brothers Henry and his brother Tom were still in Stamford at Mr Broughton's boarding school, and only came down to London during 1784.



John was educated at St. Paul's school being admitted on 24th February 1794, aged 11[iv].



For reasons which are not explained, John's parents marriage seems to have been in difficulties. Henry Hervey Baber recorded that: -





"Father and Mother parted Sept 9th. Mov'd to No 9 Gt Shire Lane Sept 16 (1794)"





Hodsons' Index of Bengal Army Officers says that John was baptized at St. Andrew's, Holborn on the 6th January 1797, which appears to be curiously delayed, and was perhaps caused by the estrangement of his parents.



By 1799 John's eldest brother Henry Baber was curate at Ibstock in Leicestershire, and John aged 16 appears to have travelled up to visit him.





1799

June. 12 John came to Ibstock & departed July 4.





Later that year Henry recorded: -





My brother John was elected Scholar of Pemb. Coll. Oxford from Abingdon School in Sept'r;



In 1802 Henry wrote;



1802

John left Eng'l; for India - went a Cadet to Calcutta. Sailed in the Duchess of Buccleugh.





John is listed as a Cadet in 1801[v]. He arrived in India on 19th July 1802.



He had been promoted to Ensign on the previous 9th July 1802 in the 8th Bengal Native Infantry Regiment.



We know nothing definite about his service in India, but he was further promoted to Lieutenant on the 24th of May 1804.



In 1851 the Army of India Medal was awarded to several officers of the 8th Native Infantry who had fought in the following battles:-.



The battle of Deig, 13th Nov. 1804.
Capture of Deig, 11th to 23rd Dec. 1804

It is possible that John Baber could have fought in these actions.[vi]



The Battle of Deig was one of a number fought in the 2nd Maratha War between 1803-1805. Under Governor General the Marquess of Wellesley, was adopting a forward policy and attempting establish EIC supremacy over the Maratha Confederacy. The EIC had supported the Peshwa against Holkar, but in 1802 the Peshwa was overthrown.



The Marquess of Wellesley launched two offensives, one into the Deccan led by his brother Sir Arthur Wellesley, and a second into Hindustan led by General Lake.



Whilst Sir Arthur Wellesley was winning the Battle of Assaye, Lake was having similar success at the siege of Allyghur, Delhi and Laswari.



It is known that the following Regiments were present at Lake's actions and were later granted Battle Honours in 1829. However the Regiments were awarded their honours under their new Regimental numbers given following the 1824 reforms.



The following table is developed from information contained in several tables in "The Indian Army" by Boris Mollo, settings out the units in Lake's army that received Battle Honours.




Regiments granted battle honour (1824 Titles)
Regimental Numbers prior to 1824.

Allyghur 1803


7th, 23rd, 35th
1/4th, 2/4th, 2/17th.

Leswarree 1803
1st, 12th, 21st, 24th, 30th, 31st, 33nd.
2/12th, 1/12th, 2/9th, 2/8th, 1/15th, 2/15th, 2/16th.

Deig 1804


5th. 7th, 9th, 30th, 31st, 33rd
1/2nd, 1/4th, 1/8th, 1/15th, 2/15th, 2/16th.




>From the table it can be seen that both battalions of the 8th Native Infantry Regiment, the 1/8th or 2/8th were involved in actions in this campaign.



Presumably John Baber was present at one or other of these actions.



There is considerable uncertainity over the date of his death. According to Hodsons' Index of officers of the Bengal Army, he died on Mauritius 16th July 1807,



It is clear that for a long time after the event that Henry Baber did not know what had become of his brother. In the flyleaf of "Memoranda relating to the life of Henry Hervey Baber" is a rough draft of a family tree. Sadly it is not possible to date the tree, but from the dates given by later additions to the tree in Jan 28. 1809, it would appear that as late as January 1809, John was thought to have "perished by some unknown means (supposed shipwrecked) in the East Indies."



At a later date this last entry was scored out and substituted by "died a prisoner in the Isle of France."



However interesting information has come to light from records held in Mauritius.[vii]



It appears that for some reason that is not apparent at present John was present on the ship Phoenix, which was captured on 20 Vendemaire an 14 (12th October 1805), by captured by the French Corsaire ship "La Henriette."



French records show that a "Jean Barber Lieutenant d'infanterie passager" was landed on "1er Brumaire an 14" (23rd October 1805) on the Ile de la Reunion.



Presumably Jean Barber was as close as the French clerk could get to John Baber.



It is possible that John was already ill, or perhaps the conditions in the prison killed him, for he died on 20 Pluviose an 14 (9th February 1806)



The records say "cet homme est resté malade à l'Ile de la Reunion - mort le 20 Pluviose an 14 »









--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[i] Died 16 July 1807 Lieutenant (since 24 May 1804) at Isle of France (Mauritius). He had gone to India in 1802.

[ii] From "Memoranda relating to the life of Henry Hervey Baber. A manuscript diary of his life, with one page per year. In Henry's own handwriting 1783.

[iii] From "Memoranda relating to the life of Henry Hervey Baber.

[iv] Hodsons' Index of Bengal Army Officers

[v] BABER, John (1783 - 1807)
Lieutenant 8th NI. Born. Leather Lane, London, 3rd March 1783. Cadet 1801. Arrived in India 19th July 1802. Ensign 9th July 1802. Lieutenant 24th May 1804. Died Mauritius 16th July 1807.

baptized at St. Andrew's, Holborn, 6th Jan. 1797. Son of Thomas Baber, of Red Lion Street, Clerkenwell, and Elizabeth, his wife. Educated at St. Paul's school; admitted 24 Feb. 1794, aged 11. Pembroke College, Oxon, matriculated 4 Nov. 1799, aged 16.



Service: Posted as Lieut. to 8th NI (2nd Maharatta War?)



[vi] Information from Steve Lewis 2000.

[vii] Correspondence dated 22 August 2003.

Dear Nick,

Philippe Lahausse forwarded me your mail. Coincidentally, last year I was in the Mauritius Archives looking up lists of prisoners of war in the Napoleonic period. There is a long list for the period you mention, and bearing in mind that the records there are in French and that the spellings of English names are very approximate, I think that the following entry relates to your great uncle:



Name: Jean Barber

Rank: Lieutenant d'infanterie passager

Date of Arrival: 1er Brumaire an 14

Name of Vessel from

which he came: Phenix [Phoenix]

Date the Vessel was

Captured 20 Vendemiaire an 14

Name of

Capturing Vessel: Corsaire La Henriette

Date of Departure: cet homme est resté malade à l'Ile de la

Reunion - mort le 20 pluviose an 14



This suggests that the corsair ship stopped off first at Reunion (the sister island of Mauritius) and dropped off Mr Barber (or Baber there) because he was ill

He died on Reunion within a year of being captured, according to the dates.

Whether you would find more in the archives there, I am not sure. But it is a French departement, and very well organized, so that would be a logical next step.



There are lot of books about the French corsair ships where you might find more about the cruise which involved your ancestor.



It would be interesting if you could send me some biographical information about Mr Baber, as I am hoping to write a book on the English prisoners of war on the islands. I have some great diaries and letters etc, and it's great when I can flesh out the names on my lists a little, with some contextual material.

Regards,

Marina Carter

,

This thread:

• [India-L] John Baber died on Isle de France by "Nick Balmer" <>