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Archiver > LITHUANIA > 2003-06 > 1054851500


From: "David Zincavage" <>
Subject: Re: [LITHUANIA-L] Fw: Lithuanian Onomastics
Date: Thu, 5 Jun 2003 15:18:28 -0700
References: <2409A35B3E1C8D4D929583798DF5AA78D7D135@whmail01.walterhav.com>


There is no native equivalent in Poland to the two root Lithuanian personal
names. Their significance in the Lithuanian case is simply an artifact of
the happenstance of Lithuania acquiring fixed surnames just before (pagan)
personal names of Lithuanian linguistic origin, generally, became extinct in
use.

A few exceptions exist, of course. (Most generalizations feature some.)
The names of certain much-admired Lithuanian grand dukes, Vytautus,
Mindaugas, Gediminas, Jogailo, Kestutis, Algirdas, survived in use to a
limited extent after Christianity arrived.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Leon Stevens" <>
To: <>
Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2003 2:13 PM
Subject: RE: [LITHUANIA-L] Fw: Lithuanian Onomastics


> > equality in naming practices came gradually over time <
>
> This is wholly unsubstantiated and false. Rymut lists a great many
> early dates of extant documents containing non-noble names, and they are
> as likely to be self-glorifying as self-deprecating. Names used in
> plays and fairy tales do not correspond with nomenclature in common use.
> Quite a few Mazovian nobles walked barefoot as did their ancestors. It
> didn't affect their names and surnames. As for antiquity, the names of
> many or most noble clans are the names of tribal forefathers and several
> of these are utterly self-deprecating or simple objects, plants and
> animals, as for example "Zlodziej" ("thief"), "Jelita" ("entrails"),
> "Rola" ("cultivated field"), "Cholewa" ("bootleg"), "Ogonczyk" ("little
> tail"), "Kozel" ("goat"), etc. All of these Bruckner, Semkowicz and
> Szymanski describe as old personal names.
>
>

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