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From: "Terry Phillips-Seitz" <>
Subject: Re: [LDR] Wives of Peter Waples (1708/9-1785)
Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2013 11:59:18 -0500
References: <D7CCE259-7518-4CE0-99AC-AA4033BAE00B@colorado.edu><1357183547.41170.YahooMailNeo@web121406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com><CAG4S1nK-xhTaO0ad-4y4KRE9MO8+vFi8e42hsUL_z3S4oakF6Q@mail.gmail.com><60E83245CAE34954A34AA9F72C25369D@NorahHP><01f501cde9e9$548f1f50$fdad5df0$@net><CACs-hTjzgzk6wgO5w5g0ur1145wWgesLA8Eq_PhG8tPb-+Ck0A@mail.gmail.com><022101cdea36$d7a1c850$86e558f0$@net><EE0F0084D76541839DA01333B7CBE904@NorahHP>
In-Reply-To: <EE0F0084D76541839DA01333B7CBE904@NorahHP>


Hi Norah-

Please, no apologies. I was just making the point that you shouldn't assume
"Swamp Tract" was near Burnt Swamp.

The Mason & Dixon surveyed only the east-west line between MD & PA and the
north-south line between MD & DE. Les Riggin pointed out that the state
line at the bottom of Delaware was surveyed by others (John Watson and
William Parsons of Pennsylvania and John Emory and Thomas Jones of Maryland
surveyed it 1750-1751) and it is properly known as the Transpeninsular Line.
I, like you, grew up in the area and we simply did not bother with the
distinction when we referred to the state boundaries.

Below Vienna, the Nanticoke does have a lot of marsh, but much of that marsh
is bounded by swamp as well. I think that the expanses of tuckahoe and
lotus, which grow in shallow water along the swamp edge/shoreline give many
the impression that there are marshes in places where there are none. With
just a few exceptions, the river above Vienna is entirely bounded by swamp.


Your comment about Trussum's Pond makes a larger point. There are lots of
places in the area that are just plain swampy, especially around millponds,
which most often originated as low, wet areas at the head of streams.
...And you are correct about Barren Creek. There are several swampy,
unusable areas in Columbia on its upper reaches. My grandparents' farm
backed up to what we called "Blackwater Creek" (really just upper Barren
Creek) and there were 50 - 100 yards along the creek on each side that were
seasonally flooded wetlands.

So you can see that "Swamp Tract" could easily have been used in a very
broad, provincial context.

Terry

-----Original Message-----
From:
[mailto:] On Behalf Of

Sent: Friday, January 04, 2013 10:13 AM
To:
Subject: Re: [LDR] Wives of Peter Waples (1708/9-1785)

TERRY,
MY APOLOGIES ON THE SWAMP. YOU'RE RIGHT. UP INTO A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO I
WAS BORN AND RAISED ON THE EASTERN SHORE BETWEEN DELMAR AND SALISBURY. I
HAVE DRIVEN THRU BURNT SWAMP AND IT IS SPOOKY AT NIGHT. I HAVE SWAM AT TRAP
POND BUT TRUSSEMS POND LOOKS MORE LIKE A SWAMP AND ITS NEARBY. I HAVE
RIDDEN DOWN THE POCOMOKE RIVER YEARS AGO AS A TEENAGER ON A PADDLEWHEEL AND
IT WAS SWAMPY AS WELL. AND IN DORCHESTER CO., MD THERE IS GREENBRIAR SWAMP
INCLUDING A HEADLESS LADY AND BURIED SILVER. SOME PARTS OF BARREN CREEK
HAVE CYPRESS TREES AND ARE A LITTLE SWAMPY. I GUESS I JUST NEVER THOUGHT OF
IT AS SWAMP. THE NANTICOKE ALWAYS FELT LIKE A MARSH THAN A SWAMP. THE
EASTERN SHORE IS VARIED SO MUCH BUT I LOVED IT. IF MY DAUGHTER DIDN'T
DECIDE TO MAKE GETTYSBURG HER HOME I WOULD STILL BE DOWN THERE. NOW I HAVE
BOTH DAUGHTERS UP HERE AND FRANKLIN CO. IS BEAUTIFUL AND I DON'T MISS THE
HURRICANES.
I DO HAVE A QUESTION. THE MASON DIXON LINE I ALWAYS THOUGHT WENT ALL THE
WAY TO THE OCEAN. IT GOES THRU DELMAR PAST LITTLE CREEK 100 AND EAST THRU

THERE. DID SOMEONE SAY IT WASN'T THE MASON DIXON LINE. I LIVE 4 MILES NORTH
OF THE MASON DIXON IN PA AND I WAS BORN AND BROUGHT UP 4 MILES SOUTH OF THE
MASON DIXON.

GOD BLESS AND AGAIN I APOLOGIZE FOR NOT THINKING OF THE OTHER SWAMPS.
NORAH HASTINGS COLLINS

-----Original Message-----
From: Terry Phillips-Seitz
Sent: Thursday, January 03, 2013 11:49 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [LDR] Wives of Peter Waples (1708/9-1785)

I don't disagree.

I limited my list to those with predominantly swampland, as opposed to marsh
along their shores. The Wicomico River, Wicomico Creek, and the Manokin
River essentially have only marshland along their lower reaches that gives
way rapidly to high ground. This may appear to be a petty distinction, but
it is/was important insofar as the relationship between high ground (i.e.
towns, farmland and wood lots) and wet lands. Only the Nanticoke has a
transition zone of swampland in some places between its marshes and high
ground. From Vienna upstream there is very little marsh- only swamp and
occasional high ground up to Seaford and Laurel. The Nanticoke continues to
have swampland associated with it as far inland as the cypress swamp at Trap
Pond, which is literally only four miles west of Burnt Swamp The Pocomoke
has swamps along its shores practically to its mouth.

Hence, I was suggesting the Nanticoke, Pocomoke and their tributaries as
candidates to consider for parcels called "Swamp Tract". Early Delmarva
residents would have been aware of the distinction between swamps and
marshes.

Interesting fact about the effect of the earth's rotation though. I had no
idea....

As a matter of curiosity, there is a VERY short canal that runs from the
Nanticoke's north shore just east of Vienna, perpendicular to the river
"inland" for about a half mile, almost to high ground. Supposedly, it was
dug entirely by slave labor in the early 19th century.... I'm not sure
about it's purpose- maybe for logging the swamp, but more likely to access
the river from nearby farms. You can see it if you Google Vienna, MD and
follow the river upstream just a bit. The Interestingly, the canal pretty
much demarks the boundary between the last marsh on that shore and the
adjacent swamp which continues upstream with few breaks.

Terry

-----Original Message-----
From:
[mailto:] On Behalf Of Jim Moore
Sent: Thursday, January 03, 2013 8:06 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [LDR] Wives of Peter Waples (1708/9-1785)

The Delmarva rivers that flow westward into the Chesapeake, the Choptank,
Nanticoke, Wicomico and Pocomoke, share characteristics, including long
length, shallow depth, meandering course, and little fast land. Those that
flow eastward into Delaware Bay are short, deep and have more fast land once
inland from coastal marshes. This difference is caused by the rotation of
the Earth.

In the 1820s, the DE legislature chartered a Milton company to dig a canal
between the headwaters of the Broadkill and Nanticoke. At that time, they
could be navigated for so much of their length, the canal would have been
only 11 miles long. Yes, a Layton was one of the investors. I can find no
record of a shovel ever being put to ground on this project.



On Thu, Jan 3, 2013 at 2:34 PM, Terry Phillips-Seitz <
> wrote:

> Actually, it is part of the Great Cypress Swamp, which follows the
> Pocomoke River through much of its course. Burnt Swamp is the
> northernmost part of this, and as such is the Pocomoke's source. The
> Great Dismal Swamp lies south of Suffolk, VA, below the Chesapeake.
> Although drainage projects and encroachment has altered its shape a
> bit over the years, it still runs from Whaleysville & St. Martins in
> Worcester County north to just south of Millsboro in Sussex County.
>
> I have heard/read of a Swamp Tract near Burnt Swamp, but you need to
> be careful.... Swamp Tract may be used as a property name in other
> places and the Cypress Swamp is a substantial buffer all along the
Pocomoke (c.f.
> Nasawango Furnace area). In addition, the Nanticoke is similar to the
> Pocomoke, with "cripples" along most of its course and those of its
> tributaries, e.g. Rewastico Creek, lower Barren Creek, Marshyhope,
> Galestown and Broad Creeks. Anyone with property adjoining one of
> these could refer to certain parcels as "Swamp Tract".
>
> Terry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> [mailto:] On Behalf Of
>
> Sent: Thursday, January 03, 2013 11:34 AM
> To:
> Subject: Re: [LDR] Wives of Peter Waples (1708/9-1785)
>
>
> HI,
> I'VE NOTED THAT SOME HAVE MENTIONED A SWAMP TRACT. BURNT SWAMP, THE
> NORTHERN END OF THE GREAT DISMAL LIES BETWEEN GUMBORO AND SELBYVILLE
> ALMOST TO THE MASON DIXON LINE. IT IS VERY CLOSE TO ST MARTINS, AND
WORCESTER CO.
> BACK IN THE DAY I BELLIEVE IT WA IN SOMERSET CO. BUT NOW IN DE.
>
> GOD BLESS,
> NORAH
> -----Original Message-----
> From: marjorie adams
> Sent: Thursday, January 03, 2013 10:13 AM
> To: Miller's Choice ;
> Subject: Re: [LDR] Wives of Peter Waples (1708/9-1785)
>
> Paul Waples' Piney Point may have been at Indian River, north east of
> Dagsboro at the end of Piney Neck Rd. DE Hwy Map, rev 2004 shows
> "Assawoman Willife Area Piney Point Tract". I think this neck of land
> was/is known as Piney Neck.
>
> The Peter, Paul and Mary you mention are children of Wiliam Waples,
> are they not? According to Runk, William inherited land on both sides
> of Indian River.
>
> On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 10:25 PM, Miller's Choice <
> >wrote:
>
> > <Peter's brother Paul lived in Baltimore Hundred of Somerset County,
> > where he shows on the tax lists until 1739; that last year his next
> > neighbor was Paul Thoroughgood. On the 1734 debt book for Somerset
> > County, Paul Waples held 500 acres of Piney Point, 50 acres of Swamp
> > in Fellowship and 200 acres of Abigail's Chance, all in Baltimore
> > Hundred. I'm not familiar with these tracts and I suspect they are
> > now in Sussex County, DE.>
> >
> >
> > Becky
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Alan Bell <>
> > To:
> > Sent: Wednesday, January 2, 2013 6:51 PM
> > Subject: [LDR] Wives of Peter Waples (1708/9-1785)
> >
> > Has anyone looked at the putative wives of Peter Waples of Indian
> > River, Nancy Thoroughgood and Margaret Rowe? Peter's will of 1785
> > does not mention a wife. Rufus Waples' Genealogy lists an unknown
> > first wife; Margaret Rowe as second wife; children William, John,
> > Benjamin, Joseph, and Nancy with the first wife; and Margaret,
> > Littleton, Mary, Jane, Elizabeth, and Peter with Margaret Rowe.
> > (Rufus was the great grandson of Peter.) Nancy Thoroughgood is given
> > as the first wife in several genealogies. But I have not turned up
> > any documents attesting to either marriage, or any Thoroughgood or
> > Rowe documents that might hint at Thoroughgood or Rowe families in
> > Sussex around 1700-1750 Nancy or Margaret might have belonged to.
> > The birth dates and order of the children (except for Peter, from
> > the
> > 1850 census) are mostly unattested as well, so the order of the
> > marriages seems speculative, as well as which mother the children
> belonged
> to.
> >
> > His daughters married Bartlett, Oliver, Hazzard, Lewis, Hall, and
Waples.
> >
> > Alan Bell, Boulder, Colorado
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>
>
> --
> Marjorie
> "Be glad of life because it gives you the chance to love and to work
> and to play and to look up at the stars."~ Henry Van Dyke
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