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Archiver > Melungeon > 2003-03 > 1046710912


From: "Dennis Maggard" <>
Subject: Re: [Melungeon] Plecker revisited
Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2003 12:01:52 -0500
References: <20030302213542.93261.qmail@web12904.mail.yahoo.com>


From: "John T" <>

> Dennis Maggard <> wrote:
> From: "John T"
>
> Frank/John T, you keep asserting this without proof. Upon what do you base
this claim? How can you possibly know that *all* Melungeons were enumerated
as FPCs? (And a what time would that be anyway?) Do you have an exhaustive
list of all Melungeons at some point in time? (If so, we'd all like to see
that list!!) If not, how can you make this claim with such absolute
certainty?
>
> Howdy Dennis, With all due respect you need to go back and study the
History of the Melungeons.

Thanks for the tip, John T/Frank.

> Have you ever heard of Edward T. Price geographic review done in 1950 as
he list the various free colored clans in the Eastern United States,

Yes.

> and guess what, he used the 1830 US Census to locate Melungeon.

Actually, I think he used it to locate free persons color.

> The 1830 census of Hawkins County and western Virginia enumerated the
Melungeons as free colored

So there were Melungeons in western Virginia as 1830? I'll buy that, but
still, how do you know that they were "all" enumerated as FPCs as you claim,
unless it is merely matter of definition with you?

> if they were white what's the big deal.

The whole point for some may have been to be enumerated as white.

> I have given you the list,

You have given me an implicit list of people classified as FPC's in certain
areas of Tennessee and Virginia. You have show me nothing to lead me to
believe that they were all Melungeons or that all Melungeons were so
enumerated in the 1830 census.

> now would you please list your white Melungeons. Dennis who are these
white Melungeons?

I have no white Melungeons in the sense you seem to mean it. Melungeons were
tri-racial -- black, white and Indian.

> You know what bothers me most about this whole question, people born in
the 1950 who have done no research are now claiming they were Melungeons and
even their parents made no such ridiculous claim.

How do you know their claims are ridiculous? People didn't call themselves
Melungeons nor did they want to acknowledge that others called them
Melungeons. (Not that I accept being called a Melungeon by someone at some
arbitrary time in the past as being the sine quo non of "Melungeoness.")

> Why are people trying to latch on to being something they are not?

How do you know that they aren't? Even more to the point, how do you know
that they know that they aren't but are claiming to be anyway?

> " I descend from Vardy Colins through his son Vardy, who is your Melungeon
forefather? Why in the world do you think the State of Tennessee filed
charges on Vardy Collinis for voting in an election, did your folks vote?
Was they considered Melungeon by any historian? it doesent make a bit of
sense to me to claim to be something you /or your family were not. Most
families have interesting histories without inventing anything extra to add
to their families stories without taking the hardships suffered by our
Melungeons families and even some on this list have claimed kin to us so
they can claim our legends.The Melungeons were real people. Dennis, the ball
is in your court name your Melungeons forefather and define Melungeons for
the list, since you are the list Moderator. Frank.
Congratulations on have such a clear line of Melungeon descent. Most of us
do not have such certainty. The fact we are still searching doesn't make us
dishonest or pretenders or whatever it is you seem to think that we are.
With me, as with many others, it to a large extent comes down to how we
define who the Melungeons were. If we define them as the descendants of
Vardy Collins, then clearly no. If you accept the "Counterfeiting" Mullins
clans of Southwest Virginia as Melungeons, then I can build a pretty good
circumstantial case for being of Melungeon decent: my family was mixed race
(certainly white and Indian and I suspect black as well going back far
enough) and was marrying into the "Counterfeiting" Mullins clan, and vice
versa, and sharing the same socio-economic circumstances.

To me, and I suspect to most people here, a broader definition of Melungeon
makes more sense than a narrow one, but it is a matter of definition. It is
nothing about which to get so emotional; it is nothing about which to try to
exclude others; and it is certainly nothing about which to be casting
aspersions upon the character of others. But if it pleases you to call me
Melungeon-related or a Ramp or whatever, John T/Frank, feel free.

Dennis



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