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From: "Michael Bruff" <>
Subject: [NMB] Re: NORTHUMBRIA-D Digest V99 #576 (Welsh in Northumbria)
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 13:43:50 +0100


>Thelma wrote
>
> There is a very good book by Alistair Moffat called ARTHUR and the lost
> Kingdoms. This is about the border country around Kelso, and he thinks he has
> proved the Welsh connection with the Scottish/English borders and has found
> many Welsh names surviving from the dark ages.

I can't comment on the book Thelma quotes because I haven't read it. Do
remember, though, that this period is *Arthurian* history, where anything
goes, and quite often does, and one can very soon find oneself in the realms
of the seriously strange. I once read a book entitled 'The Black Horses',
which advanced the theory (I am *not* making this up, nor have I been
drinking or messing around with mind-altering substances, honestly!) that
the geographical distribution of the pub-name 'The Black Horse' marked the
movement of King Arthur's armies in their campaigns against the Saxons, etc.
The argument was very cogent, until you actually started to think about it.

Establishment historians skirt round this period very cautiously, except to
question whether it is history at all, and to dismiss most of what is
written about it as tosh. This doesn't mean it is, just that very few
establishment historians are going to risk making themselves a
laughing-stock among their peers by founding theories on the skimpy evidence
that is available. Historians like solid, incontrovertible facts, and the
solid, incontrovertible facts that exist on Britain in the 5th and 6th
centuries wouldn't fill up half-a-dozen A4 sheets‹‹and probably not that.
(The facts available on Northumbria after the establishment of the Anglian
kingdom under Aethelferth in the early 7th C are, by comparison, legion).
This is why John Morris's book went down like a lead balloon in academic
circles.

On the other hand, conjecture, not to say hobbyhorsing, among
non-establishment historians is rife; within certain parameters, you can say
what you like, and no-one can prove you are wrong!

Anyone know of an Arthurian list? We could be in danger of getting seriously
off-topic here!

Mick

Northumberland Park
Tottenham
London

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