ORIGINAL-13-L ArchivesArchiver > ORIGINAL-13 > 2006-11 > 1164839623
From: "Howard Swain" <>
Subject: Re: [ORIGINAL-13] CONCORD PASSENGER LIST and the OP DEN GRAEFF'S
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 14:33:43 -0800
Hi Lori and all,
From: "La Hav" <>
Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 10:46 PM
Subject: [ORIGINAL-13] CONCORD PASSENGER LIST and the OP DEN GRAEFF'S
> Hi fellow researchers,
> I just recently joined and have, of course, lots of questions.
> I just recently started researching my line of Op Den Graeff's (Abraham Isaacs Op Den Graeff), who came over on the Concord in 1683. I discovered this family link right before Thanksgiving. It made for a special story to share with all my large family who gathered for Thanksgiving.
> I have a couple of questions regarding the Concord Passenger List.
> I have seen various ones on the web. DID AN ACTUAL LIST SURVIVE? AND DO YOU THINK IT WAS A COMPLETE LIST OF ALL PASSENGERS?<
A "passenger list" in the sense of a manifest or captain's list or oath list
from London or Philly, etc. does not seem to have survived.
Our knowledge of who those 13 first families were appears to come from
the writing of Pastorius in his Grun und Lager-Buch [Ground and Lot Book].
At the start of which he has an "Address to posterity ...".
>From the translation of the Grund und Lager-Buch by Marion Dexter Learned
Pastorious says he arrived on "the 20th of the sixth month" [August 1683]. Then:
"Soon afterwards, viz. on the 6th of the eighth month [October] arrived likewise in
Philadelphia Dirck and Herman and Abraham Isaacs op den Graeff, Lenert Arets,
Tunes Kunders, Reinert Tisen, Wilhelm Strepers, Jan Lensen, Peter Keurlis,
Jan Simens, Johanes Bleickers, Abraham Tunes, and Jan Lucken, with their
respective wives, children and servants, together thirteen families..."
For more details on the Concord (which I think came from James Claypool,
another passenger) see: Passengers and Ships Prior to 1684, ed. by
Walter Lee Sheppard, Jr., pp 96-98. There is a footnote to this which says:
For data on the Concord and the voyage, see Pennsylvania Magazine of
History and Biography vol X, pp 270, 273-5, 403, 406.
> I ask because, the Op Den Graeffs - Derick/Dirck, Hermann, Abraham - brothers, Margarit - their sister, and Geitjen - their mother, were on the ship, with all three brothers having siblings on the ship as well. NONE OF THEM LISTED CHILDREN (at least from what I have seen on the web). So I was wondering then if all their children would have been born in Philadelphia then. I did notice that some children were listed for a least one family on the ship.<
An Op den Graeff researcher can probably answer this better. But --
according to William Niepoth (trans. by John B. Lukens), "The Ancestry
of the Thirteen Krefeld Emigrants of 1683", Pennslyvania Genealogical
Magazine vol 31, no. 3, pp 191-207, your Abraham had marriage banns
published (Reformed Church) [in Krefeld?} on 23 July 1679 to Trintgen Jansen.
So, you'd think they may have had a child or 2 born before emigrating in 1683.
Your best bet for finding birth places and dates for the children is, I think,
the records of the Abington Monthly Meeting (of Quakers). You can borrow
this on microfilm from the LDS. It is film #383,428. On page 330 of
Item 2 (on the film) is a compilation of the birth dates of the children of
members of that monthly meeting. I copied a few pages, but don't have
one with Op den Graeffs on it. However, I assume they would be there.
This compilation includes children born in Europe and in Germantown.
|Re: [ORIGINAL-13] CONCORD PASSENGER LIST and the OP DEN GRAEFF'S by "Howard Swain" <>|