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From:
Subject: [PACAMBRI] Fwd: Re: Old court case information Heim/Hite/Bertram
Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2010 23:41:43 -0400
References: <8CD3E1F71822D22-1BBC-7844@webmail-m024.sysops.aol.com>
In-Reply-To: <8CD3E1F71822D22-1BBC-7844@webmail-m024.sysops.aol.com>


Marilyn Kline Washington


-----Original Message-----
From:
To:
Sent: Tue, Oct 19, 2010 11:38 pm
Subject: Fwd: Re: [PACAMBRI] Old court case information
Heim/Hite/Bertram

Patti sent me the Family Sheeet of Valentine Heit/Hite and
Martina Heim. She said there was a " + " in front of Valentine's name
in the German Records. This usually mean that the person died. This
would mean that Valentine Hite died in Germany, and did not emigrate.
That would explain why I couldn't find any record of his death or
burial in America.
If this is so, who did Martina Heim Hite emigrate with? Did she
come with a group of relatives or neighbors. Does anyone have any
ideas? She married Bertram in the US.

Marilyn Kline Washington


-----Original Message-----
From:
To: ;
Sent: Sat, Aug 28, 2010 11:19 pm
Subject: Re: [PACAMBRI] Old court case information

I recently moved. I was not able to do the packing, and
everything got mixed up. I am attempting to sort it all. When I find
the Bertram material, I can send you copies. It is NOT on the computer
yet. I failed three times with three programs and lost what I entered.
Martina Heim Haid/ Hite's husband died about 1839 and she
remarried
a Bertram about 1840. I couldn't find Valentine's death [death records
not required then, civil or church, and so, which cemetery? ] But the
priest listed her as a widow of Valentine Haid in her marriage. I
didn't know the Heim then, and it caused some confusion, as the priest
listed Martina's maiden name, Heim, in the Bertram birth records and
all the children's marriages. I think his brother was a
Peter????Bertram.
If Valentine was old enough to have married children left in
Hohenzollern, he was older than the emigrants you mentioned. He also
had to emigrate before 1839 if he died then.
One of the researchers found the church Family Records from
Hohlenzollern and transcribed them. Valentine and Martina do not seem
to be related closely enough to the other Haid families who emigrated
from there [some still keep that spelling,
The two oldest girls of Valentine and Martina were married and
did not emigrate. The younger children did, but some must have died.
IN 1848 the Revolutions in Germany changed Hohenzolern to a part
of Prussia, which meant the churchs became Protestant, and many of the
citizens left--I think it was five or seven years to change religion or
leave. The Catholic came to cambria County where previous immigrants
had settled as it was Catholic. Carrolltown had a Hohenzollern Hotel.
Supposedly Martina's Haid children changed the spelling to Hite
since the mail was getting mixed up.] My stepfather's line is
Valentine and Martina, Raphael and ??, William and Rose Sherry, and
Gerald, my step father, and Delarose Farabaugh and Helena Feighner
Kline [my mother.]. The Bertram-Hite family are in the 1850 census
under Bertram from Allegheny twp. I never bother with earlier
census--too much trouble for too little information.
Do ;you know about Fr. Ledoux's five volume [so far 1799 to 1869]
of Catholic Vital Statistics of Central Pennsylvania? This is where
most of us get the information, but some old timers [like me] have
actually seen the handwritten records. It is all the Altoona Johnstown
Diocese churchs. As churchs were founded, each year expanded the no of
church and data, and shortened the time period of the particular
volume. The hard period is from 1870 to 1893 when counties started to
keep records. In 1906 the state took over all records except marriage.
There are naturalization records from about 1840 to the early 1900s
when the Federal gvt took over. The amount of information here varies
with the current rules and the type of volume used to

Marilyn Kline Washington


-----Original Message-----
From: <>
To:
Sent: Fri, Aug 27, 2010 11:57 pm
Subject: Re: [PACAMBRI] Old court case information

Hi Marilyn, 

I am indeed researching Bertrams. I have only gone back a few
generations, to Henry Bertram (the subject of the article) and his
father, Peter Bertram, who was born in 1841 and may have emigrated from
Germany. I was very interested in this case because Henry Bertram
married an Elli (Barbara Elli) and so that would suggest some sort of
interfamily argument. 


I have (since I posed the original question) found other items I want
to research re: court actions but I am not sure how much I'll find as
these are more sensitive cases. I learned that my great-uncle and his
girlfriend-slash-common-law wife apparently had five children together.
I've heard a few variations on this but long story short, two of them
(twins) were taken away by child services and the remainder were
apparently surrendered for adoption shortly after. (This man also
fathered a child during WWII in Germany. I met him a few times as a
child but had NO idea about any of this.) 


I will certainly keep you in mind Marilyn, as I verify and go farther
back. Not sure if there are multiple Bertram lines? I know Peter
Bertram and family were listed in several censuses as living in
Carrolltown. Some of his children settled closer to Altoona. I know
Tunnelhill and Gallitzin were also places where they settled. My great
grandfather Anthony Henry Bertram settled in Cresson on "the Cresson
shaft." 


I'm in Chicago but am planning a long trip back to PA so I can do some
research in person. I agree, I still think of books and hard copies of
things too, I'm reluctant to verify on what's on the Web alone. 


Thanks, 
Patrick 


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 3:48 PM, &lt;&gt; wrote:
Adoptions were also published then, and so were details of sexual
attacks.  Go figure.  I just sent someone a case of a doctor and
"illegal operations" with the name of the girl.  Dr. had to leave town.
     The clerk looked up the court cases for me.  Not to brag, but I
did a lot of primary research in the courthouse.  Tip: wear white, as
the leather is all powdery and it stains clothes--you need bleach.  I
read completely through the marriage licenses and naturalizations at
Cambria Couty.  Also many of the wills, including the original probate
materials.
     I spend a lot of time suggesting where to look for specific
information.
     This is my new computer, and I am getting used to it.  I am
definitely a pre-computer person, I still think of books when I think
research.  I had a computer rather early, but our rural phone company
couldn't connect us to the internet--it was a toll call.  My son ran up
two $990+ bills before the internet, so I wouldn't sign up.  I used it
To do school work and writing.
     Are you researching Bertrams?  If so, I am interested.   One of
the original Bertrams married Martina Heim, widow of Valentine
Hite/Hile.  She was from Hohzolllern Sigmargian. which became part of
Prussia after the 1848 Revolutions.  One of her sons to Valentine was
my step-father's ancestor.My step-father said his grand-father called
her "a witch," don't know what he meant/

Marilyn Kline Washington


-----Original Message-----
From: &lt;&gt;

To:
Sent: Thu, Aug 19, 2010 10:52 pm
Subject: Re: [PACAMBRI] Old court case information

Thanks Marilyn - I'm a "newbie" in terms of that level of search and
just wanted to get a sense of what to expect. 

I did see the Fornication and Bastardy label mentioned in the Freeman -
so it must have come from that classification. 


Thanks 
Patrick


On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 9:12 PM,  &lt;&gt; wrote:
   Yes, there are records.  Some go back to 1807.  I found one about
Fr. Gallitzin's use of the name Augustine Smith and some land
transactions.   I saw that when the storage was at Joanne Factory.
 Might now be at the Old Jail.  They have some court records, but there
is not much information.
      Those old papers had Court Reports--including adoptions--and
sometimes there was a lot of detail [from the reporter] if the case was
interested.
     A person usually brought the action, not the county.
        I found some old court records of a crime called "Fornification
and Bastardly" that proved the father of a friend's mother--he pleaded
guilty and agreed to pay.  The clerk looked it up, I have no idea where
it was located.

Marilyn Kline Washington



-----Original Message-----


From: &lt;&gt;
To:
Sent: Sat, Aug 14, 2010 6:59 pm
Subject: [PACAMBRI] Old court case information

Does anyone know how far back court records go at the county
courthouse, and
what kinds of cases are archived?

A few weeks back Patty (I think it was Patty - thanks, as always!)
posted
from the Cambria Freeman and it included a list of court cases from
December
1899. Looks like a few ancestors of mine had a dispute.

The link: http://www.camgenpa.com/news/1899CF4.html

FOR THURSDAY, DEC. 7TH
-Commonwealth vs. Pit Koyad, malicious mischief; prosecutor; C.E. Luke
et
al.
*-Henry Bertram et al., larceny by bailee; Mary A. Elli.*
-W.A. Donahey, embezzlement; Henry McAnulty.
-George Styers, malicious mischief; John Charleston.
-Diasy Bowdin, larceny and receiving; Cynthia Boring.
-William Holland, robbery; Edgar Branch.
-T.W. Burns, misdemeanor in office; Daniel Vaught

I'm just wondering if it's possible there would still be information
about
this somewhere? (I didn't see any follow-up articles so I wasn't sure
if the
resolution was ever published in the paper.)

I haven't quite gotten to the stage in my research where I start
looking for
things at the courthouse, so I am flying blind on that front.

Any thoughts?

Thanks so much,
Patrick Erwin



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